From: Christeos Pir Area: Thelema To: Paul Hume 8 May 95 11:18:14 Subject: Re: JUGORUM UpdReq -=> Paul Hume sent a message to Aesinara on 07 May 95 11:16:26 <=- -=> Re: Re: JUGORUM <=- Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law. PH> Actually, my experience with Jugorum is that it wasn't very effective PH> for exercising an addiction In fact, Regardie specifically states (can't remember in which of the umpteen books I've been reading lately I ran across it... maybe Tree of Life?) that Jugorum is NOT to be used for behavior (ie, habit) modification, but solely for training the mind. This is why the trigger (transgression) is to be stuff that has no intrinsic value one way or the other, like touching the face with the left hand, or whatever. He further says that this has an additional benefit of keeping the aspirant from making moral judgements about the trigger. (As you said in your post -- just seconding it.) Love is the law, love under will. - V - ... I am the hideous god; and who mastereth me is uglier than I. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: The Nephilim Area: Thelema To: Fir 29 Apr 95 09:41:12 Subject: THANK YOU FIR! Rec'd UpdReq Re: Re: LOOKING FOR BABALONIAN MAGICK (Sorry for such a late reply...) > Hey, if you ever get interested in the Hitites, I have a girlfriend > locally who's interested in building a whole magical system based > on them. She's always interested in corresponding with people > with an interest in Hitites. I'll take a look at the Hitites - I know they share some gods in the Mesopotamian pantheon... > Meanwhile, I've got a book titled _The Phoenician Letters_ > by Wilfred Davies and G. Zur published by Mowat Publishing, Manchester, > 1979. > This is a modern interpretation magic book dealing with > Ea, Enlil, Anu, Nergal, Marduk, Shemesh, Sin, Rimon, Nebo, and Ishtar. > If you can't find it and want a xerox copy, just say so. > Regards, Fir I CANT THANK YOU ENOUGH FOR THEEES! I found it and it's just what I've been looking for! But I have a few questions - do you know anything about this book, backround material, if it actually purports to be 10 letters of correspondences, is this sort of Phoenician Kabbala discussed elsewhere? Nephilim <1mst1024@ibm.mtsac.edu> THE TWILIGHT ZONE BBS [PIN]909-621-766324HRS14.4kbsVBBS6.10 FIDOnetVIRTUALWWIVWWIVlinkICEnetNUITnetALnet 1:218/50319092309916199039916BEASTnetPODS 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: KRLY-ENOCH Area: Thelema To: All 3 May 95 15:56:12 Subject: Hello Larry!.... UpdReq Well, you are right, there isn't much traffic on this sub, but I'm just letting you know I'm new to this area(Psychelic Realm BBS) and am interested in what people have to say about Thelema, Crowley and OBO...Never been much of a Crowlely fan myself, but his works are required reading for anyone interested in Occult Topics...his life and his works are good examples of someone who went over the edge more than once...there's a story of when Crowley met Annie Besant and he tried to seduce her with his Evil Eye...light- ning bolts flying everywhere, blowing wholes in the wall behind a Annie dodges left and right, juking Crowley out of his soiled shorts...and she is heard saying, "Haha Crowley, missed again!" Wazn't Here, Didn't Zay Dat Help Ever, Hurt Never Zensear Rearguardz ~KRLY-ENOCH~ THE TWILIGHT ZONE BBS [PIN]909-621-766324HRS14.4kbsVBBS6.10 FIDOnetVIRTUALWWIVWWIVlinkICEnetNUITnetALnet 1:218/50319092309916199039916BEASTnetPODS 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Rose Dawn Area: Thelema To: Aesinara 8 May 95 11:47:46 Subject: Re: JUGORUM UpdReq Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law. Hi again! > *snip*... um, ouch.... I can see the point of wanting to lose > unwanted habits - > this coudl probably be used for smoking, or addictions of other kinds... Actually, according to Paul, who has practiced the Jugorum thangs, it's a lot *less* effective for things like trying to quit smoking. That makes sense to me--LOL, if being short on breath and knowing it's unhealthy aren't enough to make you quit, then self-inflicted pain/discomfort from some other source probably won't be either. Who knows--the only time it was ever easy for me to stop smoking was while I was pregnant & nursing. > I don't think that it would be all that feasible. most of these things are > not conscious...one could only catch the slips if someone else washelping.. > and forearm slashing is potentially more than a mere flesh wound... Actually, that's at least part of the point to practicing the Jugorumstuff; to bring the non-conscious habits of speech, thought, and action up to the conscious level and be able to control em. Having practiced some, though not with a razor, I can tell you it's surprisingly effective. I decided to begin the Big Experiment while I was interviewing people for work, and I noticed all kinds of lazy speech habits that weren't at all conscious. Course, having a tape recorder and being able to catch it all on tape for later analysis made it easy! ;> And definitely, if I or anyone else were using a razor, it'd be crucial to be cautious and not engender a trip to the emergency room and probably psych hospital! ;> Love is the law, love under will. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Rose Dawn Area: Thelema To: Grey 8 May 95 11:50:42 Subject: Re: JUGORUM UpdReq Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law. Hiya Grey, > Try avoiding referring to oneself in the first-person tense. Thought about that and discarded the idea since my first attempts were during interviews through employment at a local newspaper...kinda difficult to approach strangers without telling them just *who* wants to interview them. The word "and" was the one that got tossed in the first round of Jugorumthangz--boy, was it ever an overused one too! :/ Noticed that every sentence outa my mouth would begin with "...and..." <"and what do you do for a living?" "and what part of town do you live in?" etc.> Interesting schtuff--we really do just yakk on without even paying attention to what we're saying a lot of times, neh? Love is the law, love under will. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Fir Area: Thelema To: The Nephilim 9 May 95 23:13:54 Subject: The Phoenician Letters UpdReq TN> I'll take a look at the Hitites - I know they share some gods in the TN> Mesopotamian pantheon... They apparently not only worshiped their own Gods but borrowed their neighbors' as well. F> Meanwhile, I've got a book titled _The Phoenician Letters_ F> by Wilfred Davies and G. Zur published by Mowat Publishing, Manchester, F> 1979. TN> I CANT THANK YOU ENOUGH FOR THEEES! I found it and TN> it's just what I've been looking for! Pray tell, where on Earth did you find it? TN> But I have a few questions - do you know anything about TN> this book, backround TN> material, if it actually purports to be 10 letters of TN> correspondences, is this TN> sort of Phoenician Kabbala discussed elsewhere? I don't have a clue. Sorry. I borrowed a book out of the library and xeroxed the chapter on Sumero-Akkadian Hymns and Prayers. It's got Hymn to Ishtar, Prayer of Lamentation to Ishtar, Hymn to the Moon-God, Prayer to the Moon-God, Hymn to the Sun-God, Prayer of Ashurbanipal to the Sun-Godd, Psalm to Marduk, Prayer to the Gods of the Night, and Prayer to Every God. You interested? Regards, Fir fir@ouroboros.org{ 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718