From: Christeos Pir Area: Thelema To: Josh Norton 15 Sep 94 18:23:32 Subject: "diary of a net fiend" UpdReq -=> Josh Norton sent a message to Christeos Pir on 11 Sep 94 23:11:04 <=- -=> Re: "diary of a net fiend" <=- Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law. JN> I don't think I've seen either article or reply. Are they available JN> somewhere I could download them? No, they're printed in the previous and current issues of Gnosis magazine. I could post my letter, but it would mean more if you read Tim's first, which is no doubt (c) by Gnosis. I'd offer to photocopy Tim's article, but I'm busier'n Aleister at a sorority house. Anyway, that'd still be covered by copyright, I s'pose. Let me know if you want to see mine anyway, and I'll convert it (I was still using DrawPerfect at the time) or re-key it. Love is the law, love under will. - CP ... One B-2 Bomber = 30,000 4-year college educations. Think about it. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Josh Norton Area: Thelema To: Tony Iannotti 15 Sep 94 14:19:00 Subject: Book of coming forth Rec'd UpdReq Thus said Tony Iannotti to Josh Norton concerning Book of coming forth: JN> Hi Tim! Haven't seen you post here in a mort of years. I've JN> missed your acid wit. TI> Believe it or not, I share your sentiments, but have still TI> not seen any posts from him here on BNet. I think something TI> is broken again in Thelema. Where is he posting from? TI> Thanks! Hi Tony! The two message I saw were from Castle Anthrax -- a Bay Area (SF Bay, that is) BBS. The node number in their footer was 31:2000/11. That's ALnet, isn't it? I see postings here from that BBS fairly frequently. We're getting them through the main PODNet node, along with the rest of our feed. ... Now hold on there, Pilgrim! ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.10 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Grendel Grettisson Area: Thelema To: Tony Iannotti 15 Sep 94 00:54:06 Subject: Book of coming forth Rec'd UpdReq > Believe it or not, I share your sentiments, but have still not seen any > posts from him here on BNet. I think something is broken again in > Thelema. Where is he posting from? Thanks! He's on Castle Anthrax in California. Wassail, Grendel Grettisson Internet:mimir@io.com 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Fir Area: Thelema To: Tony Iannotti 16 Sep 94 22:35:40 Subject: Re: MEZLA COMMENTARY Rec'd UpdReq Hi Tony, > Hi! and thanks again! I found my Mezla's and that one is missing. The Mezla reprints I got from Black Moon are not complete. A gent in town has the complete collection, having once been in the Typhonian O.T.O., and has offered to dig them out for me for xeroxing. > I wonder if the Coptic letter is not a Tau? I was wondering something similar. Regards, Fir 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: JOSEPH MAX Area: Thelema To: JOSH NORTON 14 Sep 94 09:08:00 Subject: Re: BOOK OF COMING FORTH UpdReq -=> Quoting Josh Norton to Joseph Max <=- JN> Even if there was genuine magickal work involved in the receipt of the JN> document, the circumstances are such that, had I been in Aquino's JN> place, I would have regarded it with extreme suspicion. JN> By published accounts, Aquino had concluded prior to his invocation JN> that the CoS had failed in its mission, and that it's leaders were not JN> living up to their promises. He says he did the invocation to find JN> guidance and a solution to the matter. The result of the invocation JN> confirmed his feelings, declared him the magus of a new aeon, and JN> directed him to set up a new organization. As I said before, there were more than enough _practical_ reasons for Dr. A to go ahead with the split from CoS -- I know Anton personally, having been the technician who installed his electronic music studio at the Black House and spent a number of evenings in conversation with the man. He's not a bad fellow, actually, but I can see how up against another Mage with an equally high-intensity ego there would be sparks a-flying... JN> In other words, what he got was _precisely_what_he_wanted_to_hear_. JN> From my experience and training, this should have set alarm sirens JN> screaming in his mind. The one thing you never, EVER, believe is when JN> "spirits" tell you that you are a prophet, a "magus", a leader, or the JN> object of some great destiny. Such results are too good to be true, JN> and almost invariably mean that an unintegrated part of your JN> unconscious is interfering with reception, or is manufacturing the JN> supposed contact. Indeed. The few times I have successfully recieved "automatic writing" in my magickal career have been times when I have A) not expected it, and B) the content came as a total surprise - to the point that in one instance it took me over a year to figure out exactly what the meaning was! I took these events as being communications from my Augoedies to myself personally, and they were not earth-shaking revelations but simple guides meant for me alone. But never were they anything I _expected_ - in one case I even went "No way! Not _this_ guy... oh, no..." though in the end it was the truth. I like Peter Carroll's comment: "I don't consider a work of invocation a success unless I'm surprised by the result!" JN> Even when the statements are true in some sense, disbelief is the best JN> course. If there is some higher power involved, then the circumstances JN> of the person's individual nature, development, and environment will JN> inevitably combine to produce the results that power desires, WITHOUT JN> any need for the person to consciously seek their effectuation. That JN> this happens is the best proof that there is a real power involved. "The price of freedom is eternal vigilance", as the saying goes. In cases of magickal effects, the price of sanity is extreme skepticism! JN> Crowley was a good example of this. Having received Liber AL, he JN> didn't immediately set himself up as the prophet of the new aeon. Just JN> the opposite; he hated the book and its teaching and did his best to JN> hide from it for a long time. It was only after years of thrashing JN> around and trying other directions that his own, independent work JN> brought him back to the very power he had sought to avoid. (I don't JN> think he ever quite got to the point of fully manifesting the Magus of JN> his Aeon, but he came pretty damn close.) Uncle Al professed a policy of extreme skepticism himself. Even TOWARD himself! ... Reality-ometer: [\........] Hmmph! Thought so... ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: JOSEPH MAX Area: Thelema To: TO META THEREON 14 Sep 94 09:08:00 Subject: Re: 'ELLO UpdReq -=> Quoting To Meta Thereon to All <=- TMT> Im a Thelemic(?) cm doing solitary work, and I just wanted to say TMT> hello. I would be interested in anyone who could tell me why I would TMT> need to know the symbols of the tree of life or any other system in TMT> order to expand my consciousness(SP). I really do not see any more TMT> than common uses for these representations, but perhaps that is why I TMT> am stuck in the muck right now "To work, brothers and sisters, to work..." There is a lot to be said for following a serious regimen of study, regardless of whether or not one understands what the point is at the beginning. I forget the exact quote, but Crowley once said that ANY work, good, bad, ineffective, mistaken -- is good. There is absolute value in doing the Work itself. I found that the construction of magical tools to be an excellent way to get out of the "muck". I happened to use the Golden Dawn's system for this, but it is not the system that is important, it is _doing the work_ that counts. The fact that their instructions are very detailed and exacting makes this work an excellent exercise, The Aurum Solis's system of tool construction detailed in Book 3 of "The Magical Philosophy" by Denning and Phillips should work just as well (my S.O. has used their system in constructing her tools to great effect.) The point of my exercise was to free myself from the _need_ to understand what it was I was doing and (as the saying goes) JUST DO IT! Finding a Master Mage as a teacher is real hard these days, so I used a written course (the G:.D:.'s) as my "master" and just _did what I was told_, without trying to analyse it in advance. Having completed it, the reasons for doing it became clear in ways that I could not have imagined intellectually beforehand. This was the lesson I learned: There is absolute value in the work itself, beyond the obvious results. A martial artist who practices Tai Chi will become a far better martial artist for it, even though the Tai Chi is not strictly a fighting style itself. A runner who takes dance lessons will become a better runner. A magician who learns a discipline will become a better magician. I found that the self-discipline involved in setting yourself a particular, long term goal and going after it to be the thing that causes one's magickal consciousness to expand. It has little to do with the particular system chosen. If the Tree of Life does not resonate with you, try the Keys of Solomon, or the Tattvas, or Tantra or WHATEVER - just make it a long term process that you know when you complete it you will look back with pride and a feeling of accomplishment. To work, brother, to work... - J:.M:.555 ... Knowing that you do not know is the beginning of wisdom. ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Tony Iannotti Area: Thelema To: Josh Norton 17 Sep 94 13:15:38 Subject: Re: Book of coming forth UpdReq -=> Quoting Josh Norton to Tony Iannotti <=- JN> The two message I saw were from Castle Anthrax -- a Bay Area (SF Bay, JN> that is) BBS. The node number in their footer was 31:2000/11. That's JN> ALnet, isn't it? Thanks, yes, they should have come through here on their way to the rest of the net, as I feed Castle Anthrax. I just saw a couple of messages from him, so perhaps I missed the earlier ones, though I do tend to recognise his name. Thanks! ... Cats always sit on whatever it is you're trying to read. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Tony Iannotti Area: Thelema To: Grendel Grettisson 17 Sep 94 13:15:54 Subject: Re: Book of coming forth UpdReq -=> Quoting Grendel Grettisson to Tony Iannotti <=- GG> He's on Castle Anthrax in California. Tanks! ... Conventionality is not morality. Self-righteousness is not religion. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Tony Iannotti Area: Thelema To: Fir 17 Sep 94 13:21:48 Subject: Re: MEZLA COMMENTARY UpdReq -=> Quoting Fir to Tony Iannotti <=- Fi> The Mezla reprints I got from Black Moon are not complete. A gent Fi> in town has the complete collection, having once been in the Fi> Typhonian O.T.O., and has offered to dig them out for me for Fi> xeroxing. I used to have the complete set from the Brocken Mountain Lodge Library, through the 11th one, but now I seem to only have 1, 2, 5, 6, 10 & 11. Nuts! I had some of the later, more recent ones from Fla, but don't see them around here either. Moved a ove year ago, and am still not completely unpacked, though. ... Ezz beeg troble for moose and squirrel. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Josh Norton Area: Thelema To: To Meta Thereon 16 Sep 94 15:50:02 Subject: Liber al prophecy UpdReq Thus said To Meta Thereon to Josh Norton concerning Liber al prophecy: TMT> I agree with your interpretation. After reading that verse, it seemed TMT> to me an accurate presentation of what occurred. Now, since this TMT> prophecy was fulfilled, was this to relate to every 40s and TMT> 80s decades to come, or was it a short, shallow prophecy TMT> because the reign of Horus is going to be a short, shallow TMT> one? This question plagues me. If you have any thoughts, TMT> write me. As a prophecy, I'd say it's a one-shot deal. Most good ones are. As far as I can tell, the Thelemic current seems strong and healthy, and likely to remain so for quite a while yet. Every decade or so it sends out a set of offshoot currents that add something new to the magickal perspective of our times. It's so strong that it's horrendously easy to contact. I wouldn't worry about it failing any time soon. TMT> Keep in mind that some say that we have already surpassed TMT> the aeon of Horus, but would this fall into the predictable TMT> 2000 years or so scheme? I personally don't believe in "aeons" in the sense that Crowley used it, or in the slightly different version promulgated by the Maatians and others. I prefer to think of them as "magickal currents" within a much- larger-scale cosmic cycle of energy flow. They direct the natural energies available at a given time, but by no means encompass or contain them. Other manifestations of those same energies continue outside the purview of the current. In my own personal view of the larger cycles, the "age of Horus" was the astrological age of Aries, which ran from circa 2600 BC to circa 300 BC. This more or less corresponds to the invasion of India, the Middle East, and Europe by various Aryan peoples, and the establishing of the great militarily-dominated empires there and in Asia. IOW, the Great Age of Kings. Rome was the last of the Aries cultures. The Aries age was followed by Pisces, which was the age of great religions. There is a lot of overlap between "ages" -- e.g., the first of the Piscean prophets, Buddha, lived a couple of centuries before the Piscean energies began to really dominate the Aries energies. Similarly, the first flows of Aquarian energy brought about the great schisms in Christianity, long before they became the dominant energy. Horus isn't really appropriate to the Aquarian part of the cycle, except as an icon of _individual_ achievement of solar consciousness, and it seems to me that he is largely used in this sense in Liber AL. I'm putting my money on this being an age in which a whole hell of a lot of people achieve that level, becoming, in a sense, avatars of Horus. What was in the past the secret of a few is going to become part of the general and accepted baggage of human culture. But that's on the individual level. On the social level, I'd say Hadit is just about perfect as an Aquarian god, for reasons I'm still in the process of formulating. ... ***This space for official use only*** ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.10 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Josh Norton Area: Thelema To: Ned 16 Sep 94 15:58:04 Subject: Liber al prophecy UpdReq Thus said Ned to Josh Norton concerning Liber al prophecy: Ne> Comment: Very nice and lucid though it disregards most of the world. Mmm. I'd have to disagree, since the US/Soviet rivalry had its effect on most regions of the world, through economic and military support. Ne> It is the warrior Lord of an earlier age (and WWII did involve most Ne> of the world) before which a later time cowers. "Of the Forties" but Ne> not "Of" the eighties. The eighties react to the warrior Lord's Ne> legendary glory. The US could be said to have expended its reputation Ne> in cowing the eighties. That's more or less what I was trying to say in the last paragraph of the message. Ne> This does begin to sound like Reagan, but I Ne> dont think it could be applied as an overall worldwide spirit of the Ne> eighties - but then the 80's, for me, were characterized by an exact Ne> lack of any unifying spirit. "Abasement" was where I lived through Ne> most of 'em. Ned. Hmmm....I'm not sure that the average peasant in, say, China, India, and Uganda, found his condition any more abased during that period than in the previous decades. ... When in doubt, empty your magazine. ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.10 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: To Meta Thereon Area: Thelema To: Grendel Grettisson 17 Sep 94 13:44:34 Subject: dreck? UpdReq It was just a suggestion because everyone seems so serious about their magickal life, and the more serious you get, the more you resemble a member of an organized religion. The only evil is organization, and I could go on about this, but remember mob rule and the Christian church. I am sorrowful for those that see fit to see anything they do as serious. If you start caring about your results, you may get caught up in a personal hell. It is not an attack against anyone, just a suggestion to realize that nothing is set in stone, and even Crowley was not always right and he would be the first to tell you this(read Magick w/o Tears). 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: To Meta Thereon Area: Thelema To: Josh Norton 17 Sep 94 13:51:48 Subject: Liber al prophecy UpdReq There does seem to be a lot of people claiming spritual enlightenment in these times, but I have only met a few whose claims I would trust. I must concede though, that the few I know of are more than I would expect to have met a century ago when that kind of enlightenment was almost horded by those of the eastern religions. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718