From: Fir Area: Mundane To: Josh Norton 28 Aug 93 01:34:48 Subject: Solitary Sent UpdReq I would just like to say that in a world of people lining up to join orders and work with groups, that it is a point of sanity to know that there are other people out there with a solitary bent. Blessed Be, Fir 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: STRYDER THE_FIRST Area: Mundane To: All Cobalt Clanners 26 Aug 93 23:56:00 Subject: Castle property funding allocated, properties being investigated.UpdRe * Forwarded from "MAGICKNET" * Originally by STRYDER THE_FIRST * Originally to All Cobalt Clanners * Originally dated 26 Aug 1993, 23:51 << TAL >> The allocation is in, and the Rammed Earth experts are ready. Properties being considered, and any others you think might fit the bill should be in the Grants Pass Oregon area, as per annual meeting vote. Special considerations as follows: ACCESS ASSURED, SEPTIC APPROVED, COUNTY NOT CITY, LOCAL CALL AREA FOR UP/ DOWNLINK ACCESS TO GRANTS PASS. Funds for up/downlink equipment to Xanadu allocated, equipment being investigated as per specification from ComSyncPNW conference, any new companies to be given bid opportunities should be submitted now, final acceptance cut off 11/1. Security teams check in. Construction teams check in. Recycling teams check in. Fire crews check in. Medical teams check in. Procurement teams check in. Groud breaking to commence 1/1/94 barring unforseen complication. That is all. May your God/dess'(s) smile upon your house.... Penned by Stryder A Brother in Cobalt, The Clan...For Man. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: White Rose Area: Mundane To: Farrell Mcgovern 27 Aug 93 07:31:02 Subject: Nuclear Power UpdReq FM> There is a big difference between Canadian Technology in Nuclear Tech an FM>US Nuclear Tech....I would not want to live within a FM>hundred miles of a US Nuke Power Plant....but I would have FM>no problems with a Canadian one 10 miles away. The big FM>difference is that we had our major "Nuclear Accident" in FM>the 50's, and We didn't let private industry set the FM>standards...the Federal Government did, based upon the FM>"Chalk River Incident". The Canadian CANDU technology is FM>the safest in the world...even in 3rd World Countries that FM>have them...like India. Quite so! I would rather have SAFE nuclear technology than NO nuclear technology...which was the point of my original post, that what the US could really use is safe nuclear power. I cannot see us all living out a latter-day hippie fantasy of everybody having their own little windmill on their own little five independent acres recovering their own little methane bubbles from their own little moo-cows. It has romantic appeal, but it isn't practical. ___ X OLX 2.1 TD X Press any key to continue or any other key to quit 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Rose Dawn Area: Mundane To: Kayla Block 23 Aug 93 16:35:28 Subject: TARTSTUFF UpdReq 93 Kayla, Just wanted to let you know, a copy of the Tart V.R. paper, Begelman's criticism, & Tart's response are ready & will be going in the mail to you tomorrow. Sorry you had to wait so long, hope you enjoy! 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Rose Dawn Area: Mundane To: Chris Olmstead 23 Aug 93 16:36:34 Subject: Re: TARTSTUFF UpdReq Hi Chris, Just wanted to let you know, I've got a copy of the Tart V.R. paper, along with Begelman's criticism & Tart's response ready for you in an envelope with your name & address on the front. I'll mail it direct from the local P.O. tomorrow morning (8/24/93). Sorry you had to wait so long, hope you enjoy! 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Lynna Landstreet Area: Mundane To: Farrell Mcgovern 26 Aug 93 08:26:52 Subject: Nuclear Power UpdReq FM> Wind can be effective, but suffers greatly from the "not made FM> here" syndrome...There are safe, effective tech for this use...and FM> it is Canadian too. It is what is know as the "eggbeater" design... That's interesting! I knew that in the Netherlands they were testing various new wind power systems, but I didn't know about this one. Do you know where I could find more info on it? FM> In many ways, it all comes down to money. Doesn't it always? FM> Gigadollar Oil firms have too much invested in fossil fuels, and it FM> will take another oil embargo to make us wake up to the fact that FM> we are too reliant on fuels that may last only another 20-30 years. The Powers That Be seem to always be too short-sighted to take into account any consequences more than a decade or so down the road... I recall reading about an early space communication project that involved sending out some kind of greeting signals to any other life-forms that might be out there somewhere. One US congressman expressed concern that hostile lifeforms might receive the signals and come and attack us, but on hearing that it would take 50 years for them to reach the nearest star system, said, "Oh, well, that's all right then." In other words, as long as the attack didn't come in *his* lifetime he didn't care...! FM> One thing that really annoys me is the whole NIMBY philosophy...I FM> hate to tell these people, but this PLANET is our back yard...and we FM> have to deal more with the source of our problems rather than trying FM> to cope with effects...treat the dis-ease, not the symptoms! My sentiments exactly. FM> WE NEED SPACE COLONIZATION TO SAVE THE PLANET! Putting all our eggs FM> in one basket is a good way to break some eggs. FM> If we don't have a functioning orbital/lunar civilization in the FM> next 50, I believe that we may slip into another "Dark Ages" ... Space colonization might be a good idea *if* the people in charge had your view of it. Unfortunately, given our present culture, it's more likely to result in an attitude that it's OK to wreck this planet 'cause there's plenty more where it came from. The fact that this world and its resources are finite has been the *only* thing stopping the military-industrial complex from completely laying waste to it. If they had an easy escape hatch, there would no longer be anything holding them back. In the hands of a more enlightened civilization, space travel could indeed be a good thing, and, as you've said, an excellent way of giving the Earth some breathing space to recover. However, it could also be the beginning of a use-abuse-destroy-and-move- on assault on the whole universe. We need some *major* social change *before* we can consider getting seriously into space travel, otherwise it stands to do us more harm than good. ___ * Freddie 1.2 * The OTHER four horsemen: Grievous Bodily Harm, Cruelty To Animals, No Alcohol Lager and Really Cool People. (T. Pratchett/ N. Gaiman) 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Lynna Landstreet Area: Mundane To: White Rose 26 Aug 93 08:26:54 Subject: Nuclear Power UpdReq WR> Where do you live relative to Rochester, NY? I live in Toronto, across the lake from you. WR> Ginna Nuclear Power plant leaked in January, 1982, for 90 minutes. WR> My farm was 3 1/2 miles downwind... Yikes! I don't think all that would have made me any big fan of nuclear power... Have there been any health studies done as to cancer & leukemia rates, etc. since then? The stats from Chernobyl are pretty horrifying... WR> These are all human failings. And unless we want to give up our WR> lifestyles and a good portion of the population, we just have to try WR> harder. Yes, but "human failings" can endanger the lives of millions of people. And I'm not so sure our present lifestyles or population levels, particularly the latter, *can* be sustained without causing massive and irreversible harm to the Mother. I wish I thought they could, but somewhere along the way I lost my faith in the omnipotence of the god of technology... WR> What's virtuous about decentralized power? I don't know about "virtuous," but on a practical and political level, technologies which put power in the hands of ordinary people appeal to me a lot more than those which make us dependent on the whims of a powerful elite. When a few people have absolute power over the lives of the rest, corruption is inevitable. It's kind of like microcomputers vs. mainframes. Microcomputers are a decentralist technology which has an overall empowering effect on the individual -- and makes conversations like this one possible. Do you think there'd be anything like PODS in existence if all computing power was in the hands of the government and major corporations, and individuals were only allowed access to it as employees, and only to complete specific work-related tasks under strict supervision? WR> LL> And of course, not as much effort is being put into exploring and WR> LL> improving the more decentralist technologies I mentioned because WR> LL> there's not as much potential for profit there.... WR> WR> What's wrong with profit? It motivates people to try harder. Nothing's wrong with profit per se, but there's often a lot wrong with some the actions that it -- or the desire for it -- inspires. In the case I mentioned, safer and more ecologically benign technologies are being suppressed in favour of riskier and more damaging ones because the research facilities and scientific brainpower are in the hands of a government/corporate elite who care about nothing but money and power, and there is more of both of those to be had from technologies that disempower people and put our lives at risk. It makes people try harder, yes -- try harder to make money for themselves, no matter what the cost to other people, or to the Earth. I know I've probably come off sounding a bit like the proverbial wild-eyed anarchist in this post, but what the hell -- someone's got to do it. :-) ___ * Freddie 1.2 * The OTHER four horsemen: Grievous Bodily Harm, Cruelty To Animals, No Alcohol Lager and Really Cool People. (T. Pratchett/ N. Gaiman) 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Fir Area: Mundane To: Tumbleweed 28 Aug 93 18:33:14 Subject: Seattle Sent UpdReq > Seattle has a Lot of California transplants. T> Is this good or bad? *grin* I've liked all the people in the community that I've met that I know are from California. Is that where you're moving from? 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Fir Area: Mundane To: Mark O. Garrison 28 Aug 93 23:23:42 Subject: Pagan Publications Sent UpdReq I liked your poem in the Bridge. I wanted to ask you if it would be alright if I set you up with a subscription of a publication that I'm donating time to, Shadowplay? I copied off your address when you posted it to Christeos. BTW, Grendel's BBS is down, and I have reason to believe that it may be down for another week, so I won't be around here much for a little while. Talk with you later. B.B. Fir 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718