From: Josh Norton Area: MagickNet To: Rose Dawn 6 Aug 93 16:03:02 Subject: Re: millenialist-mediums UpdReq Thus said Rose Dawn to Josh Norton concerning Re: millenialist-mediums: RD> Hello Josh! Hi Rose! RD> RD> I see. I was being ridiculous and you had something intelligent in RD> mind! No big surprise there. ;> I've been trying to think of RD> examples from the present day and really can't come up RD> with much--other than the same old stuff about RD> hysterically induced mass hypnosis among groups, the RD> untapped power of the sub- or un- etc. as a rational RD> explanation for the efficacy (or apparent efficacy) of RD> magick in general. Doesn't seem as though we've evolved RD> much as a species--the particulars may get grander with RD> time, but the themes seem to be eternal, and the realities RD> simply more refined variations thereon. *Are* there any RD> "modern mystic myths" that approach originality or do RD> people simply keep trying to find explanations for the RD> same mysteries, and repeating more sophisticated versions RD> of year-dirt legends? Hmmm. Good question. The best place to look for modern "mystic myths" is in science-fiction; those authors sometimes seem to hook into the things floating in the public unconscious and put them into their stories. The most common modern myth I've seen -- and one that bears on your comment about lack of human evolution -- is the one about the creation of a conscious, self-willed "race soul" out of the combined consciousnesses of the individuals making up the human race. One sees it in early SF in Arthur Clarke's "Childhood's End" and in the Arisians of E.E. Smith's "Lensman" books. Many others have used the same theme since. I think this constitutes a "modern" myth, since I haven't seen it mentioned in any Western literature earlier than the mid-1800's. In magick, Nema's "Maatian" system is predicated on the future existence of such an entity, and it is used as a sidebar feature in some others. You find that same myth is pervasive in the New Age groups oriented towards the more common folk; and I've found that many people who are otherwise uninterested in spiritual ideas have come up with this one on their own and find it very desireable, though not immediately attainable. It exists as an undercurrent throughout our culture. The features of this myth that distinguish it from earlier ideas of everyone being taken up to heaven and being made one with/in God are: -- The entity in question is an _evolved_ being, something arising from the continuing development of the human race, rather than being produced by a pre-existent God or other divine force. -- The entity, while greater in scope than human beings, remains imperfect and evolving within the context of its new existence. It also continues to exist within the same physical universe, rather than being transported to some ideal never-never land. -- The entity is a participatory event. That is, the individuals who make it up continue to exist as individuals, and to have their normal lives in the world. The race-soul consciousness is _added_ to existing forms of awareness, rather than replacing them. -- And _every_ human being, regardless of their standing in the mundane social structure, is thought to have an equal place in the entity's formation. In relation to the lives of its individual participants, this myth-entity is often perceived as providing a means by which individuals can find or create a place in society based on a true evaluation of their characters, rather than being arbitrarily plugged into places in an artificial power-structure. I personally think that this myth is a current example of a divine ideal working its way down through the planes. It's part of a larger change in the zeitgeist that includes the centuries-long movement away from hierarchical social systems and towards government by common consent. "E Pluribus Unum" expresses the same idea in a more abstract form. All the democratic, socialist, and libertarian ideologies reflect it on a lower level; they differ from the myth only in that they restrict themselves to mundane-plane means and structures, and differ from each other mostly in terms of assumptions, not goals. What first appeared as something relatively abstract, as ideas in the minds of a few social philosophers, has worked its way down to the less- abstract emotional level and taken a form that appeals to the predominantly emotional orientation of the majority of the human race. I haven't the foggiest notion what this "race-soul" will look like or how it will manifest on the physical plane -- if it ever gets that far. I do suspect that if it does, we will all be surprised at the form it takes. ... REALITY CHECK ... Nope, none here! ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.10 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Josh Norton Area: MagickNet To: Morgana 6 Aug 93 16:04:04 Subject: Re: millenialist-mediums UpdReq Thus said Morgana to Christeos Pir concerning Re: millenialist-mediums: JN> But Elvis is a good example of how some myth-patterns persistently re- JN> appear in human cultures. The mythical Elvis is a modern-day clone of JN> King Arthur, the pre-Arthurian Merlin, Buddha, etc. All their stories JN> have the same basic plot elements, with just a slightly differing JN> emphasis in particular cases. Mo> ??????? Mo> Elvis=Arthur=Buddha? Mo> well, you're certainly entitled to your opinions... Mo> ...but whatever you were smoking, I wish you'd shared.... Heh. This should have been addressed to me -- don't blame Chris for my brainstorms! See my note to CP under the subject "Elvis the Savior" for some more detail on this notion. ... Pardon me boys, is that the Chattanooga Choo-choo? ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.10 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Kayla Block Area: MagickNet To: Paladin 6 Aug 93 23:46:20 Subject: THAT tome UpdReq 93 paladin, KB> if you don't mind me asking, how have you managed to get KB> access to old masonic libraries? P> a) be a Mason i'm female---i don't think they'd let me....\ thanks for the info though. 93, ----kayla 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Ismark Area: MagickNet To: Beorn 5 Aug 93 02:52:00 Subject: Re: HELP!!! UpdReq In a message dated 08-01-93 17:32 BEORN wrote to GRIZZLY: Gr> want her to..... see what a good person she is B> B> Maybe you could nudge her towards getting professional help. Just B> being B> there to listen to her is probably the best thing you can do short of B> that. Try not to pressure her too much, tho. B> Gr> Anger? Why all the anger if you don't mind me asking.... B> B> Hold on to your hat...it's not a pretty story: B> B> I had a bad childhood in a home filled with mental illness. I never B> got B> any support or affection from my parents. I don't *ever* remember B> getting B> a hug from either one of them. We moved around a lot, so I never had B> any friends either, in fact I got beaten up a lot (and worse). B> B> When I got to college, I got heavily into alcohol and drugs. The B> combination B> of that, my background, and heredity caused me to go over the edge. I B> sank B> into suicidal depression and what was probably clinical paranoia, but B> I never B> sought help...I couldn't trust anyone. I managed to roll a car over on B> a B> highway and added injuries and post-traumatic stress to the mix. B> Eventually B> I flipped out completely when a lightning bolt *just* missed me while B> I was B> tripping on LSD. B> B> I eventually recovered (or at least got the worst stuff suppressed). B> But just B> as I began to get on my feet, I was severely injured by a cop car that B> ran B> a red light, and had to spend lots of money on lawyers. In the course B> of B> the next two years, I fell down a flight of stairs, got evicted, B> developed B> *severe* arthritis in my spine and most joints in my body, developed B> liver B> problems, and got gout too. There was other stuff too. B> B> Basically, I am now a very bitter and lonely person. I was just fired B> from B> my job because of my personality and now have to face the fact that I B> will B> very likely go bankrupt if I don't find a job. Unfortunately, my B> self-esteem B> is so low that I'm gonna have difficulty selling myself. Wild thoughts B> of B> suicide alternate in my head with the desire to go join a Monastery. B> If there B> were Wiccan ones, that is. B> B> However, not to worry. I've contacted the local counseling B> center...and B> am going on retreat with a Sufi mediation teacher next weekend. He B> seems B> to specialize in helping people in distress to stand on their own B> feet. B> My Pagan belief in the sanctity of all life (including my own) will B> keep me from doing anything stupid. Whew!! Best of luck. You have my support. And, the fact that you are still around is indeed a tribute to your strength. You haven't a thing to worry about, you'll make it just fine. It's individuals like yourself that restore my faith in humanity. It's good to know that someone like you can take all that sh*t and come out still standing. I wish *I* had that kind of strength. ...Pain is the fuel of progress. -> Alice4Mac Eval:27Jul93 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Mark O. Garrison Area: MagickNet To: Fir 6 Aug 93 10:00:38 Subject: Alchemy UpdReq DO WHAT THOU WILT SHALL BE THE WHOLE OF THE LAW On 04 Aug 93 07:15:00, Fir had this to say about Alchemy: F> I've got 4 volumes from 1979 of a pamphlet called Parachemy F> published by the Paracelsus Research Society in Salt Lake City, F> Utah. Do you know what that organization is up to these days? Im not really sure...I haven't heard that name for ages now :) :)...I suppose I will look them up today or tomarrow and see if they are still around, and/or see what they have done since '79, (I know that they were active into the mid 80's, as that is when I first caught wind of them) for you. F> Also do you know if The Alchemist Handbook by Frater Albertus F> is in print these days? I haven't seen it in the bookstores and F> I let go of my copy a while back. Samuel Weiser has the 1974/1987 softcover edition of this book still available on their 1993 Back-list. It is listed as ISBN 0-87728-655-8 and runs for $12.50 new. Their phone number for ordering is 1-800-423-7087 or if you would prefer to fax your order, their number is 1-207-363-5799. Serpents Occult also has this very same version available for the same cost...Their number is 1-904-760-7675. Holmes Publishing might have this book in monograph form, if you would prefer that...as it would be significantly cheaper...but I would have to double check my catalogs from them. However, if you would prefer a hardcover edition, they would be the ones to ask. They, I'm sure, should be able to locate a good used hardcover copy for you. Their number is 1-206-771-2701, and their Fax number is 1-206-337-0585. F> Thank you for any information you might have. Blessings, Fir No problem! :) I live only to serve! :) :) I hope that some of this might have been of help... Love is the law, love under will, Mark O. Garrison 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Fir Area: MagickNet To: Gary Clark 6 Aug 93 23:10:00 Subject: Serpent Magic UpdReq GC> Dion Fortune mentioned in her book "Moon Magic" about Serpent GC> Magic. I've never heard of this type of magic. If anyone knows GC> anything about it or where I could find info on this type of GC> magick leave me a message. I loved Sea Priestess but never made it all the way though Moon Magic. What is the context? There is a book published by S.U.N.Y. Press called the Cult of the Serpent, by the way. Blessed Be, Fir 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Thomas Izaguirre Area: MagickNet To: Rakshasa 6 Aug 93 11:46:14 Subject: Re: SATAN, BUGS BUNNY, AND ME UpdReq R> 1) I've heard stories (which may well be apocryphal) about sick people R> who were healed after visits by Elvis Presley. Has R> Elvis become a modern-day Christ figure. I have R> noticed that fans of Elvis, like fans of Jesus, seem R> to have a particular fondness for tacky polyester R> clothing, but this may only be coincidence? R> 2) If so, can we assume that Elvis has Remanifested R> "on a higher plane" and thus those people who have R> seen him aboard UFOs, etc. may well be right? I believe that a kind of Elvis egregore may be taking shape, mostly because of the hagiographical excess of his devotees. To an extent Elvis Presley did have some archetypal appeal as a kind of Orpheus/Adonis type figure but it is hard to pin down what forces would shape to the "reality" of the fellow. Similarity to the Egyptian custom of offerings to the dead is noteworthy here, for it seems that that does establish some kind of link; not to the deceased necessarily, but to what that deceased represented in the minds of those kindly disposed to him/her. Similar attributions of miracles have been reported of JFK and the Romanovs (many in the Russian Orthodox Church wish the assassinated imperial family canonized to sainthood as martyrs for the faith). Fortunately, this mere devotion, however fervent, can only go so far. I say this because otherwise there might be something to the Hundredth Monkey phenonmenon. A critic of this myth (which has become the cornerstone of some peace movements) said that it is more chillingly Orwellian than Aquarian; what empowers is not the value of beliefs or their moral force, but simply how many you have on your side. Otherwise, we'd all be worshipping at the altar of Elvis! R> 3) Re. Bugs... was his position weakened when the Powers That Be R> sanitized his cartoons for popular consumption? I R> can remember when Bugs was in his full glory on R> Saturday mornings; it grieves me to see a Kinder, R> Gentler Bugs. He certainly didn't like that, that is why he is getting them where it hurts: convincing them to risk stupid-ass programs that fail and cost them a bundle, all the while the cable networks and stations preserve the integrity of his original works! 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Joker Area: MagickNet To: M-Taliesin 6 Aug 93 09:28:36 Subject: Re: Intro Magick UpdReq M-> M-> / M-> | M-> ()MMMMM|>>>>>TALIESIN>>>>> M-> | M-> \ M-> thought you might be interested in seeing an Ansi/ascii I designed for my net. BattleNet: -Joker 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Albert Saperstein Area: MagickNet To: Ace Lightning 8 Aug 93 22:24:14 Subject: THAT tome Sent UpdReq The "Simon" NEC. is far too erudite to have emanated from the filthy paw of Slater. Check out the works of Samuel Noah Kramer for verification. I have done extensive researches into the Sumerian (inc. extant language references) and can say with assurance that apart from the Lovecraft references & names the "Simon" NEC. is an accurate, though somewhat debased, Sumerian grimoire. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Varden Area: MagickNet To: Chris Olmstead 6 Aug 93 02:01:00 Subject: Re: Solve... UpdReq -=> Quoting Chris Olmstead to Varden <=- CO> the net that could tell you more, but that's it in a small nut-shell. Thank you! I think that's enough to get me started! Goddess Bless )0( ... I know a good tagline when I steal one. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Brian Hicks Area: MagickNet To: Dathan Shane Tinney 6 Aug 93 21:48:00 Subject: ufo UpdReq You are a deranged psychopath if you've seen UFOS. Unless of course you were on acid at the time. Goat 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Dathan Shane Tinney Area: MagickNet To: Brian Hicks 7 Aug 93 08:41:00 Subject: ufo UpdReq BH > You are a deranged psychopath if you've seen UFOS. Unless BH > of course you were on acid at the time. your sooo nice to me aren't you? but no i've never done drugs and don't plan to even if my parents do.. and it was when i was real young like 5 or 6 years of age.. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718