From: The Thespian Area: MagickNet To: Paton Wright 20 Sep 92 02:49:00 Subject: Re: Pagan Seminary UpdReq re: needing to graduate from a seminary to minister in the military.. maybe we could convince them to accept our pedigrees as legit? ie, if you can trace your lineage back to Gardner, you're ok? :-) Maybe we could just start up one of those mail order things you see in the back of the Enquirer (you know...for $5 donation, you can become an ordained minister?) Thes. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Daniel Duran Area: MagickNet To: Airmid 21 Sep 92 16:26:38 Subject: Adf UpdReq Thanks for the referal! I've talked with Domi and she has been very helpful. Your, and everyones, assistance has been great. I will be in touch more often in the future, once I get through a little "ADF" orientation period. Hope to discuss many interesting topics. Dan 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Gerald Del Campo Area: MagickNet To: Kevin Bold 20 Sep 92 19:00:38 Subject: Re: INTRODUCTION UpdReq Hey Kevin. 93! We miss you here, in Oregon too Bro :) Love is the Law. Gerald ... RPSTOVAL OASIS: Free your mind; your ass will follow. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Matt Drury Area: MagickNet To: All 22 Sep 92 07:05:02 Subject: Hooray! Fed again! UpdReq With this message, London BBS returns to MagickNet and PODS after being away for too many years. (Settling in with popcorn in hand to catch up on the messages.) 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Airmid Area: MagickNet To: Erin 20 Sep 92 12:24:00 Subject: Re: Irish Sources And Stu UpdReq ER> I agree. The Japanese expect that of you as well. The better ER>your Japanese is, the more they expect you to BE Japanese. I did fine till ER>it came time for the submissive, docile woman part. There I didn't do so ER>well. And I'm afraid I set some Japanese men some problems to solve as well ER> But I was always being told I was "onna rashiku nai" (not feminine enough). ER>I doubt that I'll do any better if I should ever get to Ireland. But the ER>reason I'm taking Irish is to read it--though I'd like to speak it as well. ER>And because my anscestry is over 3/4 Irish. The more I study of the ER>language, the better I understand my family, and therefore, myself. Which i ER>what I think it's all about. The other thing about magick that we need to remember is that it causes change! While it helps us to understand the magick and religion of another culture when we speak the language, that doesn't mean we have to take all the attitudes to heart and =become= every aspect of that culture. Because we are re-inventing religion and magick (in most cases) we are free to choose those things that work for us and ignore those that don't (like Druidic sacrifices in Gaul, for instance.) In the same manner, speaking a language doesn't make one a part of the culture, but it does help one to understand it. OLX 2.1 TD Proofread carefully to see if you any words out. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Michael G. Area: MagickNet To: Freydis Vasa 21 Sep 92 18:20:00 Subject: Your Belief System UpdReq You seem to "like" the points made in my post, but you're problemmed by my "rhetoric" on "incompetent occultists." Specifically, I never attacked incompetent occultists: I criticised intellectually incompetent occultists. My post was meant to be provocative, but it wasn't meant to give you or anyone else "a reason to believe." (Wasn't that an Elvis Presley song?!) There's entirely too much "belief" out there, too much credulousness, too much cowtowing to authority. If the points I made were true, or if they stimulated some thought, then whether you're a believer or not is irrelevant. For the record, I'm certainly not holding myself out as someone to believe in. Occult belief systems are dense and really pretty fatuous. Enormous personalities with bigger egos make grandiloquent statements that the masses blindly quote. Creativity/individuality isn't furthered, it's set back. To give you an example: Levi pronounces that the pentagram confers dominion over the elements. Somehow that statement gets accepted and put into common circulation. Interestingly enough, Chinese five element theory in acupuncture uses a pentagram symbol too, but it connotes something totally different from Levi's version. In Levi's version, magic is an exercise in DOMINION and POWER, one "controls one's stars", and the Son of Levi comes to spell Magick with a phallic "k" for emphasis. The Chinese pentagram was not a statis thing. The flow of its lines and angles were meant to connote the fact that in a balanced energy system, element flows into element, complementariness abounds everywhere, and nothing is static. The Chinese five element pentagram is thus a symbol of what I'd call, using computer lingo, the Human Operating System. It's a totally different perspctive and locus of consciousness than is presented in most Western occult texts. I think that there is much of value in in the Western tradition, but it is largely obscured under a layer of musty old belief systems which have become brittle and hard. Let's give things a fresh look! 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Stephen Hovey Area: MagickNet To: Swinger 23 Sep 92 09:09:44 Subject: cards Sent UpdReq You might call on them, but would you INVOKE one? 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Stephen Hovey Area: MagickNet To: Barbara Kennedy 23 Sep 92 09:13:14 Subject: cards Sent UpdReq One last comment to you.. Do not be afraid to decipher your cards in ways that feel right but completely conflict with what a book or another card reader might claim to be the card's true meaning.. They are a focus.. a psychic kick in the pants.. and to me at least, have no other power than that in themselves.. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Stephen Hovey Area: MagickNet To: Rakshasa 23 Sep 92 09:19:54 Subject: Re: thanks Rec'd Sent UpdReq I would think even a properly performed ritual, goetic or otherwise, with the intent to do harm to someone, would result in harm to yourself. bad karma 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Stephen Hovey Area: MagickNet To: Airmid 23 Sep 92 09:21:06 Subject: Pagan Seminary Sent UpdReq Yes.. sad shape in some places like in the city I live.. I was in our only occult bookstore a few weeks ago and they had a sign for 'wicca 101' at the low low price of only $60 a head. Am I mistaken in the idea that to charge for 'classes' is to get on the godess' bad side? In any case, I thought it was in rather bad taste 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Stephen Hovey Area: MagickNet To: The Wiccan Witch 23 Sep 92 09:24:44 Subject: Re: Sun? Female? Sent UpdReq Excuse my gettin in on this so late.. Im not even sure what you were responding to... but I have 2 cents anyway. I believe that many gods and godesses are personifications of aspects of the same god/goddess/demon... Im not saying there is only 1.. just that any 1 may be an aspect which in combination with others points to one actual entity.. So.. the moon may have its masculine, feminine, good and evil aspects and be one deity... maybe that was only 1 cent.. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Kevin Filan Area: MagickNet To: Stephen Hovey 23 Sep 92 18:45:26 Subject: Re: thanks Rec'd Sent UpdReq I would agree that any ritual intended to perform harm to another would cause harm to yourself because of Karma...but I think I would use a considerably different description of Karma than what I suspect you are using. (Lots of thinking and suspecting there...) I think of Karma as cause and effect. In getting in touch with the parts of our brain concerned with things like anger and revenge...especially when we are aflame with those desires and thus unable to rise above them and consider them objectively...we are risking a loss of control and a subsequent obsession by those parts. That, I think, is what happened in my case. I don't believe in Karma as a "good deeds rewarded/bad deeds punished" ideal. That, I think, is a Westernization of the concept of Karma. If a ritual to harm someone were done correctly, and the parts of the brain which are brought up in that instance, were drawn up and controlle, then I think the person would be harmed and no ill effects would result to the caster. This, of course, is very difficult to do...and I would think twice before ever attempting it agian. Not because I fear my evil deeds would be punished...but because I don't think I'm enough of a magician to control those parts of my mind, especially when I'm angry enough to actually _want_ to hurt someone. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718