From: Alex Area: Thelema To: JOSH NORTON 8 Sep 94 19:40:00 Subject: Ashtar? UpdReq JN> Depends on whose book you're looking at. Transliterations vary. Had a quick look to check it out. It would appear that the two words were used interchangeably in Hebrew. Also seems that it's not just a matter of transliteration, as there is a difference in the Hebrew spelling. (I'll use a few conventions here for transliteration. ` = the letter ayin or ain, ' for aleph, all consonants in CAPS, a l.c. "h" for the aspirated form of a letter, e.g. Th for unpointed taw, a colon after the vowel to indicate a long vowel and 2 colons for the vowels normally transliterated with a circumflex.) `aShTa::RO::Th. The long "o" is written in Hebrew as a waw with a dot above it. `aShToReTh. the waw is missing. All of which is pretty irrelevant really, since, as noted above, the two words apparently were used interchangeably. JN> And recall that "Ashtoreth" was NOT originally a Hebrew word; it was the JN> name of a non-Hebrew goddess in one of the lands they invaded. "Ashera" JN> is an equivalent from another city of the time, which also entered JN> Hebrew as a word for both the goddess and her sacred tree. Interestingly, the script which we know as Hebrew was actually brought back from Mesopotamia by the Jews when they returned to Jerusalem from the Captivity. Asherah is translated in the KJV as "grove", but in the New International Versio (NIV) as Asherah pole. Both words are feminine. All very interesting, but I guess it doesn't really matter much, does it? Blessings, Alex * SLMR 2.1 * Unable to locate Coffee -- Operator Halted! 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Brian Dare Area: Thelema To: Joseph Max 12 Sep 94 20:06:48 Subject: Re: Secret Rites of the O.T.O. UpdReq JM> regularly to keep up. I think that _all_ occult knowledge should be freely JM> disseminated; the whole idea of "this knowledge is JM> dangerous in the hands of JM> the uninitiated" is a red herring IMHO. A Well said! We speak of the new Aeon, but we all seem to be behaving not much differently from those in the old! 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Navitae Area: Thelema To: Andrew Haigh 8 Sep 94 18:12:28 Subject: Re: XI UpdReq N> What kind of lubricant did A.C. use in the XI? AH> Probably Goat's milk butter. No doubt mixed with minced eye of newt and tongue of bat. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Navitae Area: Thelema To: Christeos Pir 8 Sep 94 18:13:48 Subject: Re: XI UpdReq Na> What kind of lubricant did A.C. use in the XI? CP> Sand. };-> Ah, the earth element. Wouldn't salt be more appropriate? 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Navitae Area: Thelema To: Ben Gruagach 8 Sep 94 18:27:22 Subject: Re: finding books UpdReq BG> Used bookstores are also excellent sources for cheap and out-of-print BG> books. I went to university at Queen's in Kingston, Ontario, and my BG> favourite bookstores were the secondhand ones. I got many valuable BG> books there, from a hardcover copy of Rossel Hope Robbins' BG> "Encyclopedia of Witchcraft and Demonology," to Jane Yolen's "Favourite BG> Folktales from Around the World." Depending on the store, you might be BG> able to get books at good prices - I was able to get my books for less BG> than the cover price in most cases. Not in Vancouver. I used to shop the used book stores on a regular basis when I lived in Maine, but around here it's ridiculous. They even sell cheapo SF paperbacks at outlandish "antiquarian" prices. I've been very unhappy trying to satisfy my bibliophilia since I moved here. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Navitae Area: Thelema To: Paul Hume 8 Sep 94 18:28:56 Subject: Re: GD UpdReq PH> Fir - F> There was an article by Richard Kaczynski titled 'Of Heresy F> and Secrecy: Evidence of Golden Dawn Teachings on Mystic Sexuality' F> in Issue 7 of Eidolon. That looks like what you're referencing. PH> Bingo! If Navitae cannot find a copy, he may be interested in a PH> xerox for his files. PH> Paul You bet. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Navitae Area: Thelema To: Josh Norton 8 Sep 94 18:30:06 Subject: Re: levi in the equinox? UpdReq Fi> Someone suggested that there's a translation of one of Fi> Eliphas Levi's books in the complete set of the Equinox. Fi> Can anyone confirm this and if so tell me which of Levi's books Fi> it is? TI> Yes, Levi's The Key of the Mysteries was published as a TI> supplement to one of the numbers. I'd have to find out TI> which one. JN> You could probably find the Dover or Weiser editions of _Les_Clefs_ JN> cheaper than buying the Equinox for it. Or get the digitized version off the nets for free. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Navitae Area: Thelema To: Joseph Max 8 Sep 94 18:35:08 Subject: Re: Secret Rites of the O.T.O. UpdReq JM> ....... or what we Chaos Magicians call the Invocation of JM> the Augoeides - "We" Chaos magicians? 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Navitae Area: Thelema To: Brian Dare 8 Sep 94 18:45:22 Subject: Re: Secret Rites of the O.T.O. UpdReq JM> regularly to keep up. I think that _all_ occult knowledge should be JM> freely disseminated; the whole idea of "this knowledge is JM> dangerous in the hands of JM> the uninitiated" is a red herring IMHO. A BD> Well said! BD> We speak of the new Aeon, but we all seem to be behaving not much BD> differently from those in the old! Well, we've got over 1,900 years left to work out the details. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Navitae Area: Thelema To: Fir 8 Sep 94 18:44:10 Subject: Re: XI UpdReq NN> Although this sounds like a prurient question, it isn't. Since NN> one purpose of the ritual is to produce the Elixir, any NN> elements introduced into it are going to affect it's character. Fi> In this day and age of safe sex, there are people who teach Fi> that the sacrament can be mixed outside of the bodies. Certainly someone can say (with a fair amount of accuracy) that mixing the sacrament outside of the body is medically safer. However, since we're not talking about sex as such, but magick, I have my doubts about the practice. At any rate, I still want to know what A.C. used for a lubricant. 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Tony Iannotti Area: Thelema To: Navitae 13 Sep 94 20:39:40 Subject: Re: levi in the equinox? UpdReq Navitae wrote in a message to Josh Norton: JN> You could probably find the Dover or Weiser editions of _Les_Clefs_ JN> cheaper than buying the Equinox for it. N> Or get the digitized version off the nets for free. Sure. Available here and many other fine digitisers. (We also do QIC-80) 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Tony Iannotti Area: Thelema To: Fir 13 Sep 94 20:55:54 Subject: MEZLA COMMENTARY UpdReq F> But other people may be interested in it. Want me to mail you F> a copy? Got it, and the donation, bless you madly! Thanks! Here it is electronically... (It'll be interspersed with the book in a file that is freq'able from bnet soon.) (please report typos.....) 1. AdA (Apep deifieth Asar.) 2. Leverson (Let excellent virgins evoke rejoicing, son of Night!) 3. Yoni 5. "Sleeping in Carthage" ({Phi} & mouth) 7. The body, on a special altar 8. A. L. had gold hair & green eyes 9. Naval filled with Green Chartreuse (or hashish?) 12. {Pentagram} as usual 13. {Hexagram} as usual 15. Preliminaries, Unguiculation at {Coptic?} 16. (The wheels are the chakras) Then shalt thou excite the wheels with the two and the third in the midst {Cauda Draconis}; and {Saturn} and {Jupiter} (ears), {Sun} and {Moon} (eyes), {Mars} and {Venus} (nostrils), and {Mercury}. (mouth) 17. Descending the body with caresses? 19. As in VI{degree} O.T.O. 20. Ceremonial destruction of Christian symbols 22. ? some rite of cutting? {sun}{moon} 23. Erectio Penis 24. Begin act. 28. Flagellation 29. Sucked kisses 32. The Lord will descend & give ecstasy. 37. ? Refers to IX{degree} 41. Take care V. is reliable. 42. i.e. with the Victim 43. See "Energised Enthusiasm" 44. I've forgotten this oath; there may be a record somewhere. It 46. contained words like: "my body and soul that shall never be parted in sunder" 50. Drinking catamenia? 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718