From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: rakshasa 5 Oct 92 18:12:32 Subject: Joining the Temple Rec'd UpdReq Trying to grasp the mysteries of Joining the Temple, Blaise inquired of rakshasa, ra> Not bad for an opening letter. I would try to be more clear ra> about exactly which beliefs you shared and go into a little more ra> detail about the astrology you're interested in (the general ra> consensus within the Temple of Set is that astrology is of little ra> value--I personally haven't found that to be true and would like ra> to see others with an interest in the subject within the Temple). The Devil, you say. Astrology is both for personal analysis and for interpretation of ancient symbolism. Any well cast horo- scope shows much about the persons natural inclinations and even tastes in food. The German form of astrology---called cosmobiology which was developed in the 30's---was based upon empirical fact gathering and testing of ideas against a harsh reality. When I cast a chart with this the results have always amazed everyone concerned (always including me). As for divination, astrology is of limited use. It is the divination side of the ancient sidereal astrology of which I co-discovered* that I need help on in the form of gathering of facts on people's past. I found that autobiographies and biographies aren't helpful to do this. The fact gathering must be done in person one-to-one. ra> Other than that I think everything else is very good--and I ra> think it will be sufficient to have you recognized as a member of ra> the Temple of Set. If they ask you for references feel free to ra> give my name--I'll be more than happy to send a letter of ra> recommendation if required. Thank you for your assistance. By the way, what is you month,date, year and time of birth and where were you born? I'm anxious to show you some of what astrology can do. * I say I co-discovered it because the original discoverer of the age quotient that is the central secret of the system was my mentor, Dick Talbot (I'm sure you never heard of him. He was one of those Masters you read about but have to be VERY lucky to find and even more to be taught by one). When he told me to test his system out on reality I found I had to make a few changes in the way it was cast in order for it to work. When he saw those changes he denounced my form as non-Talbot and said that I could use the system under my name if I chose. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: rakshasa 5 Oct 92 21:04:34 Subject: Egyptian Words Rec'd UpdReq Trying to grasp the mysteries of Egyptian Words, Blaise inquired of rakshasa, While reviewing messages to include in my letter I found an old one of yours that I didn't answer. So ra> Xeper and Remanifest is a Setian greeting. What it ra> basically means is "Develop through willed self-conscious ra> transformation and then change yourself into a higher state of being." ra> X & R is much catchier, don't you think? Actually "X & R" looks either like a rock band or a railroad sign. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: rakshasa 5 Oct 92 21:32:18 Subject: Set questions Rec'd UpdReq Trying to grasp the mysteries of Set questions, Deep Black inquired of rakshasa, Here is yet another old message I found. ra> BL to Rak) he said he was a Satanist from Georgia, that there ra> were a lot of Satanists from Georgia... ra> Now I _know_ the guy was full of shit! I lived in Georgia ra> for three years and was, to the best of my knowledge, the only ra> Satanist in Athens, Georgia. (There are a few Setians in ra> Atlanta--they form the Bifrost pylon). While many Athenians were ra> very hospitable to "New Age" or "Wiccan" ideas, they found ra> "Satanism," "Setianism" or "Crowleyanity" to be repugnant, ra> dangerous, and the signs of a sick mind. ra> Of course, they could have just been reacting to _me_ ... :) Boy, that guy from Georgia was really messed up. He seemed to belong to an organization which claimed they were Satanist but weren't. That's kinda like belonging to a gang that claims they are the Hell's Angels and find out that they're actually a church group. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Deep Black Area: Base of Set To: Grendel 6 Oct 92 07:57:00 Subject: Re: Set questions UpdReq I agree with you that the RHP vs. LHP semantics is very slippery. I'll define myself as LHP and allow others to define themselves. I do know that many groups have tried to distance themselves from us as if we had the plague. Obviously, in their minds, there is a huge difference. If that is fear bred from ignorance remains to be seen. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Deep Black Area: Base of Set To: Charles Nemo 6 Oct 92 08:09:00 Subject: Re: Harassment Rec'd UpdReq CN> How is that done??? *67 being dialed before the number will disable Caller ID. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: The Sinistar Area: Base of Set To: Graham Jenkins 6 Oct 92 12:20:00 Subject: Re: Hello? UpdReq GJ> Hello in there. GJ> DataServe Systems BBS is still alive! Good to see we're fixed up.. -=sinistar=- 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: Grendel 6 Oct 92 07:15:42 Subject: Set questions UpdReq Trying to grasp the mysteries of Set questions, Blaise inquired of Grendel, >> It is precisely for these reasons that the White Magick schools >> discourage students from ceremonial magick. Gr> Which "White Magick Schools" are you referring to specifically? Gr> (I dislike vague statements like this) Sorry, I should have been more specific. I had forgotten that there are more White Magick Orders than the Quabalistic one. The order that I was referring to was the Builders of the Adytum. Even after studying with them for about 20 years he was dis- missed for practicing ceremonial magic. This was from an order that is the sole heir of the Golden Dawn in America. I have more to say about the BOTA if you want to hear, but perhaps we should go to Cult Info or, if you have it on your BBS, Tarot echo since the BOTA is mostly a Tarot school. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: rakshasa 6 Oct 92 11:32:32 Subject: Joining the Setian Temple Rec'd UpdReq How do you like this draft? To Magistra Linda Reynolds Executive Director of the Temple of Set Madam, I am Stephen Dexter Morgan, my birth date is 5/25/48. I am a male. Since you have strict requirements for admission I will give you some of my postings to Setians on Purgatory BBS as an example of my beliefs. I understand you are aware of the board Purgatory as being the home of the "Base of Set" nationwide echo message base. I post on Purgatory as Blaise. To: rakshasa Message #: 14790 14717 14791 From: Blaise Submitted: 29 Sep 92 20:24:00 Subject: Set questions Status: Public Received: Yes Group: SET (28) ra> Bl) Goodness is that which prolongs life on earth and evil that ra> which shortens life on earth... ra> Sorry, Blaise, but I don't think that definition is ra> entirely satisfactory. What about the suffering terminally ra> ill--is prolonging their existence so they can endure more misery ra> a "good" thing? And is euthanasia, then, an "evil." I don't ra> think so...and I feel I can make a good case for it. ra> Could you offer another definition of "good" and "evil?" Goodness. I love this. You really make me stop and think. When I was defining goodness I did so using as the example to define the meaning the Law of Moses' ban on eating pork. The reason was you couldn't keep it long in the warm Judean climate without it spoiling and giving you tomane poisoning. Tattoos and pierced ears would also cause infections when administered under the unsanitary conditions prevalent at that time. Going through each of the Mosaical laws one may find the reason always that something was banned because it lead to illness or infection if practiced. But now you give me a case in which the life would be lengthened to the suffering of the liver of it. So let me modify my definition to cover that. Goodness, then, is that which prolongs enjoyable life while shorting unenjoyable life on earth, and evil is that which prolongs unenjoyable life while shorting enjoyable life on earth. If you give me a case that would contradict that statement I will modify it more. BTW, the my original assumption is probably what doctors use to justify their belief that a suffering patient should be maintained at all cost. =-=-=-=-= To: Blaise Message #: 14870 14792 14871 From: rakshasa Submitted: 30 Sep 92 14:02:00 Subject: Set questions Status: Public Received: ** New Message Read! ** Group: SET (28) Basically, it sounds like you and I use the same standards for determining good and evil--that is, a utilitarian, relativistic standard. You're not telling me things are "good" or "evil" because of "Holy Writ" or the "Will of God." You're thinking as a Setian or LHP philosopher would--good and evil are functions of an action's results and not of some outside standard of "good" or "evil." And you standard sounds like a decent one for the time being--I can't think offhand of a contradictory example. If one were to arise, I think you (and I) would then try to think of another standard to work by. One of the advantages (or disadvantages) of relativistic ethics is that you have to stay on your toes and keep thinking. Your comment about doctors prolonging life at all costs because of your earlier assumption is a perceptive one. It also helps to show the danger of attempting to create a Written in Stone ethical standard--before too long you're causing pain and suffering by trying to keep to your old standard, which was designed to _avoid_ them. Xeper and Remanifest Rakshasa aka Setian Kevin T. Filan I* =-=-=-=-= To: rakshasa Message #: 14791 14790 14792 From: Blaise Submitted: 29 Sep 92 20:49:00 Subject: Set questions Status: Public Received: Yes Group: SET (28) ra> BL) I don't feel I HAVE a Superego, Ego, or Id...but I feel that ra> at any given time I may BE one of the above... ra> ra> I'd have to disagree with you on that. From my magical ra> experience I've found that often our "higher moral standards, et ra> al" are really tied in with our "id" more closely than we'd like ra> to imagine. How so? Could you elaborate on that further? As for myself, I find that much which passes as high moral standards have been, on critical analysis, just something people have been taught was the right thing to do until it had become a habit. For example, belching is considered an improper thing to do. Yet the real reason for the taboo is mostly because we grew up being taught that it was improper rather than that the act would cause us illness or death or some other type of suffering if we did it. A further example is the convention of men wearing ties. What dire illness or suffering would result from not wearing ties? Though a man wouldn't be considered amoral to not wear a tie at a business meeting, one would think it from the way people stare. Although my examples weren't quite on the line of morality, if you would stop and think, I believe that you would find that there is less a line of distinction between morality and good etiquette than you might have thought previously. =-=-=-=-= To: Killer Instinct Message #: 15828 From: Blaise Submitted: 02 Oct 92 19:48:00 Subject: More Religion Status: Public Received: No Group: RELIGION_LOCAL (20) KI> got it out of my system for today. If you've been watching then KI> news you probably know that Sand Springs schools are ignoring the KI> rule and praying at football games. I go to a Sand Springs KI> school (Charles Page) and going on about how holy and righteous KI> it is to pray at football games is driving me crazy. I always irked me to hear the prayer "Jesus, let us plow those guys in the ground. Amen." from one team and "God, please help us break these guys legs" from the other team. What does God do, toss a coin? =-=-=-=-= To: Deep Black Message #: 16820 16321 16858 From: Blaise Submitted: 04 Oct 92 14:07:00 Subject: Set questions Status: Public Received: No Group: SET (28) >Bl> DB> I am not a Satanist. >Bl> How are you different than a Satanist? DB> It really has, in my view, very little in common with the COS. You make Satanism sound like a denomination of the LHP religion and that only members of the Church of Satan can rightfully call themselves a Satanist. That, to me, is like saying only the Disciples of Christ can only rightfully be called Christians; Or that only fans of the local piano player from Dallas named Bhudda should rightfully be called Bhuddists. Did not Ipsissimus Aquino pray to Satan before receiving the Crystal Tablet? Wasn't only after he received the Message that he started calling the One he was seeking Set? DB> The only real basis for rejection is joining for frivolous reasons or membership in another organization with principles contrary to the Temple. "....Principals contrary to the Temple". Hmmm. As I see it, the principals of the Temple are very similar to the principals of all other major religions and occult organizations including Christianity. The goals however are very different from many other occult and religious organizations. By principals, if I understand the term, the CoS is referring to their high ethical standards of conduct and devotion to the God Within. Both are true of Christianity. Where they differ is TO WHAT the God Within refers. In Christianity, the God Within is a part of That Which is Not You; that part being called the Holy Spirit (aka the giver of the Mind of Christ, another That Which is Not You entity which resides Within). In Setianism, the God Within is apart of That Which is You. The goal of the Setian and Jehovah's Witness is everlasting life on earth and that of the non-Jehovah's Witness Christian and most other occult orders is everlasting life in a non-ter- restrial plane. The alternate goal of ALL faiths and orders is Godhood. But, here again, how this is can be achieved is what makes the different religions and organizations unique in their methods and teaching. Magistra Reynolds, I hope that these postings would do more than what I might say on my behalf now to show you whether or not I am Setian material. I know YOU will Xeper and remanifest, Stephen Morgan If you approve of this draft I will send it off. I am told by The Sinistar that the Conclave is to be meeting soon and that I should hasten my mailing in order to get in before the Halloween rush (25 more shopping days). With my mail being slow here anyway I'll need to expedite it. To quote a scene in the movie _Willow_ "Time is running out". 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Astral Invader Area: Base of Set To: Blaise 6 Oct 92 13:41:00 Subject: Re: Set questions Rec'd UpdReq Bl> By "Satanism" do you mean what the CoS believes as contrary Bl> to Bl> what the Setian believes? I'm talking about the basic tenets of Satanism as a part of one's personality and way of life, rather than a 'deity centered' philosophy....I think Satanism is very compatible with Setian ideals from this context.... Bl> To me a Satanist is a person who studies, works with and Bl> perhaps Bl> worships the Prince of Darkness. Both the CoS and ToS would Bl> belong to that category. Well actually you'd be slightly incorrect in that statement, since Setians do not 'worship' just as the COS does not 'worship'.....The Temple's stance is more in line with a condition of 'acknowledgement', where the COS was more closely related to a kind of secular humanism, IMO.... Bl> not Satan the Ipsissimus Aquino evoked who gave him the Bl> Crystal Bl> Tablet? If Set was not Satan Aquino got the wrong guy, didn't Bl> he? Just because He wants to be known by another name doesn't Bl> change His nature. You see, both you and the Order see the Set and Satan, according to Temple literature are the same entity: 'The Prince of Darkness'....However it is more accurate to refer to him in the more ancient (thus original) term....The Egyptian: 'Set'.... Bl> Satanist as a Christian would the term Fundamentalist. I see Bl> the Bl> term as generic of all persons who call upon the Prince of Bl> Darkness even though their beliefs may vary. Interesting point, and this is why when tabloid talk shows ring up the 'Satanists' for an interview you might see Temple members there....Profane society sees the entire sphere as 'Satanism' whereas we are aware of the difference....However, since it is so closely related (at least on the surface) I don't see any reason why we can't sit with Geraldo either....}:) /Astral/ 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Astral Invader Area: Base of Set To: Blaise 6 Oct 92 13:42:00 Subject: Re: Set questions Rec'd UpdReq Bl> Eye? One eye?? Dear. A cyclops. It's just an expression....You know, like when someone says 'Hey, I'm gonna shave my head with this cheese grater!!..' they don't REALLY mean it literally.... /Astral/ 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Astral Invader Area: Base of Set To: Blaise 6 Oct 92 13:43:00 Subject: Re: Set questions Rec'd UpdReq Bl> What are we talking about? Models of the 'puzzle box', from _Hellraiser_.... /Astral/ 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Servant Area: Base of Set To: rakshasa 6 Oct 92 15:45:00 Subject: Re: Gnostic gospels Rec'd UpdReq Well, if you believe in Soddom or not, that is your opinion. I, for one, believe in the Bible... Homosexuality is immorality! It is considered immoral = the Christian point of view. I do not see where our conversations are going... I just wanted to let you know, that through my belief, homosexuality is a sin. THERE IS NO WAY WE CAN PROVE WHICH IS CORRECT because we have different standards and morals... 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: rakshasa Area: Base of Set To: Blaise 6 Oct 92 16:57:00 Subject: Re: Joining the Temple Rec'd UpdReq Thank you for the kind words. My astrological information is as follows: May 1, 1965 in Montrose, Pennsylvania at 7:03 am...I'm a Taurus with moon in Taurus and Gemini rising--my chart has a strong prominence in the House of the Rising Sun. I'd be interested to see what you observe from you chart. BTW, which house system do you use--Placidus, Koch, Porphyry (my particular favorite), Campanus, Regiomentatus, or Equal House? Xeper and Remanifest Rakshasa aka Setian Kevin T. Filan I* 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: rakshasa Area: Base of Set To: Blaise 6 Oct 92 17:01:00 Subject: Re: Joining the Setian Temple Rec'd UpdReq Not bad...I might drop the comment to Killer Instinct and put in another response to a message from myself or Deep Black--that would give them a better idea of what your feelings were concerning Setianism. Although I might just let it go as it is...it should be adequate to get you in as a Setian. Xeper and Remanifest Rakshasa aka Setian Kevin T. Filan I* 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: rakshasa Area: Base of Set To: Servant 6 Oct 92 17:25:00 Subject: Re: Gnostic gospels UpdReq Se> Well, if you believe in Soddom or not, that is your opinion. I, for Se> one, Se> believe in the Bible... Homosexuality is immorality! It is Se> immoral = the Christian point of view. I do not see where our Se> conversations Se> are going... I just wanted to let you know, that through my belief, Se> homosexuality is a sin. THERE IS NO WAY WE CAN PROVE WHICH IS Se> CORRECT because Se> we have different standards and morals... I think you've hit up on the key there, Jeff--we have different standards and morals. I base mine on observation and reasoning; you base yours on a Christian paradigm. This is not to say I am right and you are wrong. There are certainly times when an uwavering belief unchallenged by questions can be advantageous. There are also, though, times when this becomes dangerous. Your statement "Homosexuality is immorality!" is interesting. I don't mean to sound denigrating, but on a logical diagram that looks like the statement of the child who, being told Santa does not exist, replies "I don't care! I believe in him anyway!" What you are saying is that when your faith is challenged with facts (and I'll grant that the city the archaeologists discovered might not be Sodom) you will say, "I don't care! I believe anyway!" You might want to check in an archaeology magazine about Sodom and Biblical archaeology to try to disprove my statement. At the very least this would show a willingness to question your beliefs--and to expand them when they are found wrong. I'd assume the branch of Christianity you follow is Fundamentalism--the idea that the Bible is literally true in every sentence, word, and letter. This is not, as you may think, the original form of Christianity. This is an offshoot of Christianity which became popular in the United States in the 19th Century. Before that time Christians had held that the traditions of the church, the teachings of Church fathers (such people as Augustine of Hippo, Origen, Constantine, etc.) and other ideas were a part of Christianity as well. The Bible was looked at as a handbook and guide--it was not considered "literally true." When I called Sodom a myth what I meant was this--when you read the story what is the moral of it. What I get out of the story, as told in the Bible, are two things; 1) God will spare a city if he can find even _ten_ righteous men in the whole place; 2) When God chooses to destroy something, best you don't turn back and look longingly upon it, lest you become a pillar of salt. From this I gather that God is merciful but, when he chooses to destroy something as unworthy, it is utterly destroyed and to cling to it is to risk being destroyed with it. This, to me, is the lesson of Sodom and Gomorrah; whether or not there was an actual Sodom or whether or not it burned isoff little interest to me. The point of the story is what is important. I'd be interested in seeing your thoughts on that subject; when you look at the Bible as a series of myths (that is, stories designed to hint at deeper truths and present them in a symbolic way) instead of an actual, factual document like our modern newspaper (the equivalent of which did not exist until the 18th Century) then you will, I think, get a different and more satisfying picture of what Christianity is all about. If you'd like I think a discussion of this nature would be more in line with the topic of this echo than the old "Is Homosexuality Immoral" thread--and we could probably both learn something from it as well. Xeper and Remanifest Rakshasa aka Setian Kevin T. Filan I* 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: Astral Invader 6 Oct 92 14:44:54 Subject: Set questions UpdReq Trying to grasp the mysteries of Set questions, Blaise inquired of Astral Invader, >Bl> By "Satanism" do you mean what the CoS believes as contrary >Bl> to >Bl> what the Setian believes? AI> I'm talking about the basic tenets of Satanism as a part of one's AI> personality and way of life, rather than a 'deity centered' AI> philosophy....I think Satanism is very compatible with Setian AI> ideals from this context.... >Bl> To me a Satanist is a person who studies, works with and >Bl> perhaps >Bl> worships the Prince of Darkness. Both the CoS and ToS would >Bl> belong to that category. AI> Well actually you'd be slightly incorrect in that statement, AI> since Setians do not 'worship' just as the COS does not AI> 'worship'.....The Temple's stance is more in line with a AI> condition of 'acknowledgement', where the COS was more closely AI> related to a kind of secular humanism, IMO.... >Bl> not Satan the Ipsissimus Aquino evoked who gave him the >Bl> Crystal >Bl> Tablet? If Set was not Satan Aquino got the wrong guy, didn't >Bl> he? Just because He wants to be known by another name doesn't >Bl> change His nature. You see, both you and the Order see the AI> Set and Satan, according to Temple literature are the same AI> entity: 'The Prince of Darkness'....However it is more accurate AI> to refer to him in the more ancient (thus original) term....The AI> Egyptian: 'Set'.... >Bl> Satanist as a Christian would the term Fundamentalist. I see >Bl> the >Bl> term as generic of all persons who call upon the Prince of >Bl> Darkness even though their beliefs may vary. AI> Interesting point, and this is why when tabloid talk shows ring AI> up the 'Satanists' for an interview you might see Temple members AI> there....Profane society sees the entire sphere as 'Satanism' AI> whereas we are aware of the difference....However, since it is so AI> closely related (at least on the surface) I don't see any reason AI> why we can't sit with Geraldo either....}:) AI> /Astral/ AI> --- QuickBBS 2.75 AI> * Origin: Purgatory : In Nomine Dei Satanas (1:170/811) 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: Astral Invader 6 Oct 92 15:16:28 Subject: Set questions UpdReq Trying to grasp the mysteries of Set questions, Blaise inquired of Astral Invader, >Bl> Eye? One eye?? Dear. A cyclops. AI> It's just an expression....You know, like when someone says 'Hey, AI> I'm gonna shave my head with this cheese grater!!..' they don't AI> REALLY mean it literally.... They dont? Oh. Ok. But you DO like to consume souls, right? That reminds me of a creature I saw on Dr. Who one time. They were called Finruns (I think). They are an ancient fore runner of witches. They gather and form one massive body from 13 of them. After they all gathered together they would enliven a skull into a form of a beautiful woman who eats souls. You're not a Finrun are you? I KNOW your not a beautiful woman. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: Astral Invader 6 Oct 92 15:33:54 Subject: Set questions UpdReq Trying to grasp the mysteries of Set questions, Blaise inquired of Astral Invader, >Bl> What are we talking about? AI> Models of the 'puzzle box', from _Hellraiser_.... Have you check out Starbase 21? I saw a replica of Pin-head there with a puzzle box in his hand. Perhaps you could get the name of the person who made that figurine and have him or her make you one. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: rakshasa 6 Oct 92 20:13:02 Subject: Limbo Rec'd UpdReq Trying to grasp the mysteries of Limbo, Blaise inquired of rakshasa, ra> Not bad...I might drop the comment to Killer Instinct and put in ra> another response to a message from myself or Deep Black--that ra> would give them a better idea of what your feelings were ra> concerning Setianism. Although I might just let it go as it ra> is...it should be adequate to get you in as a Setian. Ok. I will have by the time you read this be in the limbotic state of Setian in waiting to be acknowledged. Now what? I cant look any of the Setian only material and I don't have any more important questions to ask. Do you have a task for me to do? Would The Sinistar Astral Invader or Deep Black have anything for me to do? Or do I do nothing yet but sit and wait and pop corny jokes like Popcorn does? 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: rakshasa 6 Oct 92 22:01:34 Subject: Gnostic gospels Rec'd UpdReq Trying to grasp the mysteries of Gnostic gospels, Servant inquired of rakshasa, ra> I'd be interested in seeing your thoughts on that subject; ra> when you look at the Bible as a series of myths (that is, stories ra> designed to hint at deeper truths and present them in a symbolic ra> way) instead of an actual, factual document like our modern ra> newspaper (the equivalent of which did not exist until the 18th ra> Century) then you will, I think, get a different and more ra> satisfying picture of what Christianity is all about. If you'd ra> like I think a discussion of this nature would be more in line ra> with the topic of this echo than the old "Is Homosexuality ra> Immoral" thread--and we could probably ra> both learn something from it as well. The problem is, rakshasa, that the stories of the Bible talk about cities that have been discovered to exist and has a dating system that seems to fit all we know about scientific dating. Even the Flood fits. So although to view the Bible as a bunch of Aesop-type fables would be informative, the odds that what was written in the Bible as to who did what to whom at what time in what city are very much in its favor as any Middle-East archaeologist would testify. No Sodom nor Gomorrah have never been discovered, but I would bet they existed in the form described by the Bible. The only mythical places and perhaps events of the Bible happened before the Flood. Eden, Nod, the tree of life, the tree of knowledge of good and evil, a talking snake, men living for hundreds of years, giants breed from "the Sons of God" and women, have not been discovered and may perhaps not ever be (especially the snake) but Sumerian pre-antediluvian stories were just as far-fetched in the same way. That would lead to the postulation that much of what came before the Flood was gotten from the non-Semitic Sumerians via Acadians who were Semitic. But what came after the Flood is more credulous as with the Sumerians and Acadians. I'm wondering if the time of the Flood that so many cultures widely separated from each other by distance mention in their various religious stories was nothing other than the time the last Ice Age appeared. Of course, the ice would melt around equatorial regions causing flood conditions making this also the Flood Age in those regions. Any comments upon that? 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Blaise Area: Base of Set To: rakshasa 6 Oct 92 23:55:56 Subject: In limbo Rec'd UpdReq While in Limbo, Blaise thought it would be a good idea to talk to rakshasa about horoscopes. ra> strong prominence in the House of the Rising Sun. There is a place in New Orleans.... ra> I'd be interested to see what you observe from you chart. ra> BTW, which house system do you use--Placidus, Koch, Porphyry (my ra> particular favorite), Campanus, Regiomentatus, or Equal House? Equal house. I haven't done one of my castings in 4 years. I will have to brush up so it might be a while for the postdiction in which I tell you what you had done from the time of birth until your present age. The personality analysis will come much faster as I am more certain about that. On that I use Cosmobiology. As I mentioned before I really need someone who is familiar enough with the basic principals of astrology to go around to all of his or her friends and get some data on their past. After I show you something about what I discovered (to my continued amazement at the very perceptive Ancients who originally discovered all of this and since astrology isn't based on any known scientific force or law) perhaps you might want to help me with it or know someone who can. I work with stars as much as I do with planets. The Ancients had 28 asterisms or lunar signs sometimes overlapping the solar signs. Each of these asterisms had names and from correct interpretation of the symbolic names I found that I could postdict when a person met a certain type of personality that effected their life in some way. The Egyptian story of the Two Brothers is played out, I found, from the 17th to 21st years of everyone's life. More on that later when I review my notes. One preliminary thing I remember about sidereal Arians are that they are laid back people. The one I know well can go to sleep on a dime and is quite gentile. Unfortunately, Aries refers to the time of conception so I haven't been able to accumulate a great deal about that particular sign's asterisms. You might though have a lot of planets in asterisms I AM familiar with. If not, you perhaps you might tell me certain things about yourself so may more fully understand the Arian asterisms. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Charles Nemo Area: Base of Set To: Rakshasa 7 Oct 92 02:43:56 Subject: Re: Necronomicon Rec'd Sent UpdReq R> My idea on disposable people is something to R> consider. How many people are there in America R> today who have effectively "dropped through the R> cracks" of the system? Who knows if they live or R> die, and how they die? It's something to talk R> about on the SERIAL echo, anyway. Yeah, it sure is. It's been estimated that serial killers "take care of" about a quarter of the 20,000 homicides annually in the U.S., and that there are between 50 and 200 active serial killers in the U.S. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Charles Nemo Area: Base of Set To: Rakshasa 7 Oct 92 02:47:14 Subject: Re: Drugs and Spirituality Rec'd Sent UpdReq CN> My lifelong experience has been that most of the CN> apparently charismatic business and political CN> leaders I have known have been true sons-of-bitches CN> underneath -- totally unscrupulous, and with LOTS CN> of skeletons in their FILTHY closets! R> R> Agreed...but, until people develop the intelligence to pick and R> choose leaders for something more than their R> hairstyle and friendly smile,we're going to have R> these SOBs running things. Honesty doesn't win R> elections in today's society--only money and a R> good "spin doctor" does. Few people today know R> how to look beyond the image and get some feeling R> of the reality underneath. R> R> (What's _really_ frightening is this is true R> of our political leaders as well! Many of these R> people _honestly R> --- Maximus 2.01wb R> * Origin: BaphoNet-by-the-Sea -=- 718/499-9277 (1:278/666) Agreed also. Well, hold on tight -- looks like we're gonna go to Hell in a handbasket 'cause ain't nothin' gonna change for the better any time soon in the "normal" course of business or politics. Looks like it's gonna be salvation by disaster (otherwise known as Armageddon). 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Charles Nemo Area: Base of Set To: Servant 7 Oct 92 03:03:56 Subject: Standards and morals Sent UpdReq S> we have different standards and morals... No shit, Sherlock. And we're tired of hearing about yours -- or the lack thereof. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Charles Nemo Area: Base of Set To: Servant 7 Oct 92 03:10:54 Subject: Worldview Sent UpdReq How about this for an accurate worldview? 1. There is no proven kind, loving xtian god. 2. The bible is a cruel hoax. 3. Anything to the contrary is so much worthless dogshit. Am I being too blunt for your refined tastes??? 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: A.j. Drew Area: Base of Set To: Rakshasa 5 Oct 92 07:31:12 Subject: Drugs, Sodomy, and Feds. Rec'd UpdReq Rakshasa, I'd love to hear that name pronounced properly. Onto the discussion. I think the subject title I used will have attracted the attention of every Moderator who catchs it, so I'll keep it reasonably on topic. With the "New Age" and new interest in OLD FAITHS, much of what follows is washing away. However, with this new interest also comes some new concerns. For as long as I have followed my own path, as aposed to paths given to children before they can choose, I have repeatedly encountered persons of like faith or other faith that is too (also) outside of the norm of "In God We Trust" America who insist atrocities like "The Burning Times" (fill in your favorite persecution) can return. My usual responce was a chuckle. In recient times, in light of the Indian wars that no one hears about, I'm not so sure anymore. The ACLU, one of the only hopes of those who do not follow blindly, seems to have fallen almost impotent in the way of the War on Drugs, rebirth of "Morality", and other brain washing campaigns waged by the Federal Government and special interest groups. If someone wants to kill brain cells or even the whole body, it is their right. Who rules one's own body? The Government? We see it everywhere. In the abortion issue, the mandatory helmet/seatbelt laws, the 21 drinking age, and others. We see it in restraint against religion more and more. I think the expression "War On Drugs" should be replaced with "McArthism", it would be more accurate. Yes, Big Brother wants you and he wants you bad. What are you going to do to stop him? The operative word here is YOU. (c) Blessed be and ride free, A.J. Drew The Mad Monk of the Midwest P.S. Wow, I had some run ons there worthy of Jack Caroack. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: A.j. Drew Area: Base of Set To: Charles Nemo 6 Oct 92 07:11:40 Subject: An opressive government Rec'd UpdReq Charles, In a letter from you to Rakshasa dated 10/03/92 you quoted Rakshasa as saying: "The War on Drugs is a War on You", then you went on to say: "Indeed! One of many, many actions/entities designed to maintain the status quo, primarily by discouraging/punishing individuality." If you don't like it, what are you doing to change it? What was that old saying, something like: "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem"? (c) Blessed be and ride free, A.J. Drew The Mad Monk of the Midwest 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Milano Area: Base of Set To: Rakshasa 6 Oct 92 19:39:00 Subject: Re: Set questions Rec'd UpdReq -> And yet Reagan, who in my humble opinion wasn't half the president Ni -> was, managed to escape all of these charges relatively well. -> -> How do you explain Karma here? Teflon...it flew to Hart. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Charles Nemo Area: Base of Set To: A.j. Drew 7 Oct 92 18:14:56 Subject: An opressive government Sent UpdReq AD> Charles, AD> In a letter from you to Rakshasa dated 10/03/92 you quoted AD> Rakshasa as saying: "The War on Drugs is a War on AD> You", then you went AD> on to say: AD> "Indeed! One of many, many actions/entities designed to AD> maintain the status quo, primarily by AD> discouraging/punishing AD> individuality." AD> AD> If you don't like it, what are you doing to AD> change it? What was that AD> old saying, something like: "If you're not part of the solution, AD> you're part of the problem"? 1. Educate others in a low-key way. For example, circulate articles detailing the extremely onerous property seizures even in unproven drug cases and their unconstitutionality. Another example: tell people about the advantages of hemp, i.e., 4-5 or more times the yield per acre compared to wood, much less chemical treatment and pollution because of hemp's lack of bark, and much stronger rope, cloth and paper than other materials. 2. Millions of Amerikans drinking during Prohibition proved its unenforceability. Eventually the status quo will change with "soft" drugs as well (pot, acid, MDMA, etc.) although maybe not for heroin and cocaine. 3. Don't vote for conservatives! As Governor Clinton said so well, "Let's talk about valuing families rather than 'family values'!" "Family values" is just a thoughtless buzzword for the mindless status quo. 4. MAKE CLEAR IN EVERY WORD AND DEED THAT YOU WON'T ALLOW "THE AUTHORITIES" TO BULLDOZE YOUR INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS!!! If a traffic cop stops you and gives you a ticket that you feel is not right, don't take the easy way out and pay the fine! Take the son-of-a-bitch to court and fight it!!! Take it to appeals if you have to do this! Numerous other examples exist of how to fight the status quo and preserve and even increase individuality. These are just some of the things I've done and continue to do.... 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Oz Tech Area: Base of Set To: Blaise 7 Oct 92 17:41:00 Subject: Joining the Temple Sent UpdReq B> The German form of astrology---called B> cosmobiology which was developed in the 30's---was based upon B> empirical fact gathering and testing of ideas against a harsh B> reality. Who, or what group, was the inventor of cosmobiology? B> It is the B> divination side of the ancient sidereal astrology of which I B> co-discovered* that I need help on in the form of gathering B> of B> facts on people's past. I found that autobiographies and B> biographies aren't helpful to do this. The fact gathering B> must B> be done in person one-to-one. Do you use nonverbal feedback? BTW, if you're bored, you could check out the ToS reading list. An old version of the list can be found on several BBS. Oz ___ K'fung'n zyb'nos Z'j-m'h kyns el-gryn'hy. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Oz Tech Area: Base of Set To: Rakshasa 7 Oct 92 18:01:02 Subject: Gnostic gospels Sent UpdReq r> What I get out of the story, as told in the Bible, are two things; 1) r> God will spare a city if he can find even _ten_ righteous men in the r> whole place; 2) When God chooses to destroy something, best you don't r> turn back and look longingly upon it, lest you become a pillar of r> salt. From this I gather that God is merciful but, when he chooses to r> destroy something as unworthy, it is utterly destroyed and to cling r> to it is to risk being destroyed with it. An interesting analysis. (There is, of course, the question of whether righteous women would be counted; generally, in OT & NT alike, they aren't, except when distributing captured female virgins.) In terms of what lessons this might hold for a modern fledgling god, it suggests to me that one should give great leeway when dealing with one's inferiors, but be merciless and total if the facts warrant this. Do you think this is a valid "Satanic" perspective on the myth? And is it beneficial to critique Yahweh relative to one's own godhood? (Yahweh is no more intrinsically valid than any other historical god, of course; it's just that many of us have grown up in a culture influenced by this image of "divinity".) Oz ___ K'fung'n zyb'nos Z'j-m'h kyns el-gryn'hy. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718