From: Amergin O'kai Area: Night Side To: All 22 Jun 92 09:38:00 Subject: stuph UpdReq Greetings from Fennas Istarion! Well, judging from the amount of traffic that I just perused, it looks like this echo is moving again...FIAT CHAO! I picked up a lovely little publication a couple of months ago by one Daniel Kemp, called "The Book of Night, legends of shadow and silence" from IRAYA Publications. He seems to have some Thelemic background (and has published some sort of paper on puzzles in Liber AL), but this book is primarily an artistic expression of his own journey-work experiences. "We are the Ancient Ones we are the dark ones we are the darkness through which no light transmits from a time beyond Time from a space beyond Space we have come, yea, we have come..." Is anyone else familiar with his work? AOK 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Ammond Shadowcraft Area: Night Side To: Markie Chao 22 Jun 92 11:12:00 Subject: Re: More technical difficulties Rec'd UpdReq => Quoting Markie Chao to Diane Vera <= MC> I left a `did anybody miss me' message on Dragonfriend's Place a MC> couple of days ago and it still hasn't showed up! This is an old message, but things seem to have picked up in the last week. On Night_Side and BASE OF SET I sent a message to "All Sysops" about the apparent linkage problem. Tony I. saw the message and seems to have fixed it. ... Information is the most valuable commodity in the universe. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Ammond Shadowcraft Area: Night Side To: Charles Nemo 22 Jun 92 11:17:00 Subject: Re: Threefold payback? UpdReq => Quoting Charles Nemo to Diane Vera <= CN> Yes, I had noticed Nemesis' wide swing as well -- from obvious CN> Satanism to Wicca! CN> I smell a rat. A ratty, Satanic Wicca. Maybe Diane will be interested anyway. B^) ... Never attribute to malice what can be attributed to stupidity... 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Ammond Shadowcraft Area: Night Side To: The Sinistar 22 Jun 92 11:25:00 Subject: Re: freethinkers don't censor UpdReq => Quoting The Sinistar to Tim Maroney <= TS> There are some users that SysOps know as 'Problem Users'. their entire TS> reason for calling is to try and cause problems, stir the shit, etc. TS> Darklord is one of those people. My opinion is that as long as it's *your* board you can do as you please. The same goes for Harvey Smith in Cult_Watch who could kick me out at any time (and has done so in the past B^). If I were on Tim's board (if he had/has one) he'd have the right to kick me off any time he pleased. ... Nobody notices when things go awry. It looks norml. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Ammond Shadowcraft Area: Night Side To: Diane Vera 22 Jun 92 11:29:00 Subject: Re: Phil Marsh and Tani Jantsang Rec'd UpdReq => Quoting Diane Vera to Balanone <= This is an old message. I'm catching up. DV> So far, I'll just say they seem to be into an unusual blend of DV> Satanism, Wicca, goy Qabalah, quasi-Masonry, and I'm not sure what DV> all. Also they, like the editor of DARK LILY, make the improbable DV> claim that "Satanism" is older than Christianity. There's strangeness everywhere. A couple years ago I ran into an Arthurian-Wiccan from England. Interesting stuff he related to me. It appears they treated Arthur as the God. ... E.D.P. sez' "Always mount a scratch monkey!" 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Ammond Shadowcraft Area: Night Side To: Tim Maroney 22 Jun 92 12:10:00 Subject: Speech or property more important? UpdReq => Quoting Tim Maroney to The Sinistar <= TM> I've moderated electronic mailing lists, and I've been using TM> electronic messaging systems for over ten years now, so you can save TM> the "You've obviously never ran a BBS for any length of time." I have TM> more experience than you do. True. But was that on your *personal* property? TM> Once again, you are completely failing to engage the free speech TM> issues. is the right of free speech more important than control of one's personal property? ... Deaths/year: from illicit drug overdose - 5,200, from Hemp - 0. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Ammond Shadowcraft Area: Night Side To: Tim Maroney 22 Jun 92 11:49:00 Subject: RE: Re: freethinkers don't censor UpdReq => Quoting Tim Maroney to Balanone <= Yes, this is late, I got 375 messages in today... >What do you think of that side of the issue? TM> I think it is not a side at all. The owning of property does not TM> endow one with a moral right to restrict the range of opinions that are TM> expressed. Yet the sysop then risks having their personal property abused by people they welcome onto their property. I think they have an obligation to themselves to control their property in such ways as to *enhance* their position and reputations. TM> The one just reason for pulling someone's access to the information TM> networks is the illegality of their use of them. Sure. Providing it's a public propterty or affair. How can you define this echo as a public affair? It runs on private property at the sysop's expense. The sysops welcome users in and set them on their way out when appropriate (we can debate appropriate too). While some echoes could be set up to be so I don't perceive this echo as a public service. What's your opinion? TM> No one is forcing anyone to run a BBS. But if someone chooses to do TM> so, then they accept the moral responsibility of preserving freedom of TM> speech. If they are unwilling to shoulder this burden -- a burden TM> which will often force them to make painful choices -- then they are TM> unfit to be system operators and should not seek that role. And they also have *obligations* (which are really just important and intimate abstractions) to themselves. It appears that if one's personal property is not protected, then the mouth, fingers, hands, all which are personal property and which permit/enable freespeech, can be degraded (by others) to no one's beneficial use. I think this obligation (toward one's property) preceeds free speech. Comments? ... 98% of all statistics disprove the other 98%. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Ammond Shadowcraft Area: Night Side To: The Sinistar 22 Jun 92 12:09:00 Subject: freethinkers don't censor UpdReq => Quoting The Sinistar to Tim Maroney <= TM> It never ceases to amaze me how few "occultists" and "magicians" TM> realize that TM> they always have the option of refusing to take orders from others! TS> TS> OH! So I was supposed to refuse the moderator's request, thus getting TS> my entire system kicked out of the echo instead of one user? REAL TS> smart logic there, Tim... This is one of Tim's hot-blind spots. Typically, as I've observed him, he won't be rational. Perhaps there's something in his past that causes all this. Sad too, because he's so damn good on other things. ... What we have here is a failure to commun%#^$)_*$% NO CARRIER 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Markie Chao Area: Night Side To: Frater Almost 23 Jun 92 19:19:34 Subject: ASSUMPTION OF MODERATORSHIP Rec'd Sent UpdReq Wow. Does this mean that Nick will be back after Hadit gets back on-line or are you taking over? Are you going to be more heavy handed than he was about the topics? One way or another, this is sure to be interesting. 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718 From: Frater Almost Area: Night Side To: Markie Chao 23 Jun 92 19:30:16 Subject: ASSUMPTION OF MODERATORSHIP Sent UpdReq If Nick wants the moderatorship, all he has to do is say so and then start moderating a bit more...... Just enough to keep the topics straight. I'm not going to pull any "Stop that now or I'll have your priveleges revoked" because, as I've discovered to my own benefit, that crap don't work. No, instead, I'll just gently remind folks to be on-topic (As Mr. Tony I. with me recent;ly in Sex Magick and Thelema) and if they don't then I'll start posting tons of Satanic / Cthonic / Setian / Voodoo messages here.... So much so that it'd make anybody opposed to that sort of thing blanch. So, Markie, tear loose and let's talk about the Shining Trapezoheadron and the Yezidis, shall we? ;) Pax. 93 718499927771849992777184999277718499927771849992777184999277718