From: Aladrisa Area: Mundane To: Amethyst 6 Nov 94 18:15:42 Subject: Re: Abortion stuff in Metaphysical UpdReq A> It was also this for me. What did "Colleen Graham" mean to me when all was A> said and done? Absolutely nothing. My first name was just another choice m A> mother made for me and my mother was always (and always will be, sadly) this A> selfish, self-centered person who always said she loved and wanted me,but ma A> me feel like she hated me every chance she got to put me down or rip me A> apart. As for my last name, I never knew my father, but I found out later A> that he was drunk who always beat my mother until she got the guts when I wa A> 4 months old to pack us up and walk out on him. He came around all of a A> sudden one day when I was 7, but that was only because he'd had a fight with My my, and here I thought I had the only mom like that. Its pretty bad isnt it, but at least you are not like our family, where 2 out of 5 of us are my dads. :-( A> "Graham" wasn't even his...he was illegitimate...literally as well as A> figuratively, a b@stard through and through! It's bad enough I have his A> genes...I don't want his name, too! DO you see your mother at all and does she see the kids (I'll die if you say what I think you will say and that will mean we are the same in alot of ways)?? Don't forget that someday you may have to explain this all to your kiddies.... A> musical instrument and I can't draw or paint. I can't even sing anything A> anyone would want to hear. I can write, but the hard part is convincing A> myself that anyone would be interested in reading what I write, and after A> nearly 31 years of holding it inside instead of venting it properly, there's A> lot of hate and anger still there....it doesn't make for good reading. Sure you did, you already did the CBC thing, your writing about all of this *now* and thats what counts. To some it would not make good reading...but to someone like me.....its a different story. AN entirely different story. :-) You'll have to start writing, even tho it doesnt make sense and then one day, you'll have some pieces and some sense to the whole thing...trust me. Did I mention that I have a civil suit going against my parents? A> I have taken it out on my second-eldest too much, though. She'e the one who A> is most like me and I hear myself sound just like my mother when I am A> really,really angry with her. She really knows how to push my buttons A> sometimes. I'm working on it, but it isn't easy. SOunds like my step kid. A> Very true. It wouldn't have made a difference one way or the other. A> Sometimes it's really hard to face that truth...it really sucks. I was pull A> in so many directions and I did what people wanted me to most of the time, a A> for what? I got thrown away like garbage by everyone I loved. And people A> wonder why I had such a hard time dealing with love and affection. I was A> always looking for it on my own terms and running from it when it was freely A> given. My mother never gave it to me when I needed it, and when she did giv A> me "love," it was this empty "I feel guilty for calling you stupid and all A> those other names, so please forgive me" version of it. Every time she hugg A> me from the time I was 7, I wanted to run away. And when I got false, A> self-gratifying love from guys, I didn't know the difference...all I knew wa A> that it wasn't from her, and that's what I wanted...love from anyone but A> her...her's couldn't be trusted. Yeah the truth sucks, but it still matters, Obviously it matters to the both of us else we would not have changed our names. SOmetimes you have to look truth in the eye and live with it for a moment before you can let it go. Same (love from a parent) but the thought of it makes me wanna spew. A> A> What still makes me angry as hell is that she got away with it. She lives i A> denial about it. She had the audacity when she was here last December to pu A> *me* down as a parent! I'm raising 3, not one, and I'm doing a far better j A> than she did, and all she can see is the material things..."you never wore A> second-hand clothes!" "you always had a roof over your head and clothes on A> your back and food on the table, so you have nothing to complain about!" A> Well, my girls have always had all those things, too. So the clothes aren't A> always brand new, but they aren't complaining. I grew up in rented A> apartments...so my trailer is old and not in the best shape, but we own it a A> there's no mortage on it....that's more than she ever owned! *But* my girls A> have friends and self-esteem and a hundred other things I never had, like A> happiness. They still hug and kiss me goodnight...I pushed her away at 7. A> They know they are loved. It isn't perfect, but it's a hell of a lot closer A> to it than my childhood was. Same here! But you should remind her as I often used to, that a roof and clothes are fuck all compared to love and respect. I dumped my folks, and my sibs. I was always the one who wanted to notice the things that were wrong instead of putting them under a rock and pretending that they didnt exist, one day I got tired of it all and just knew it was my time to move on. My kids have a better life than I had but I manage to keep a perspective on the whole thing as to not go over board. One of these days Am (and I know actions speak louder than words) you are going to have to look the bull in the face and say "F*ck You...I take back all my personal power from you NOW and I want you out of my life." I never had a problem with that. Once I figured out what the scoop was at 17, I told her she was a f*ck. A> I think it really pisses her off that as hard as she has tried to deny the A> abuse and destroy me, I have survived and risen above it all, and she can't A> stand that! I think she would have been happier if I had taken my own life A> with a drug overdose as a teen...then everyone would have blamed me for havi A> been crazy and dumped heaps of sympathy on her. Surviving was the best A> revenge...I stand today as living proof of her failures. I can attest to th A> and she hates me for that. She knows full well that everything I have done HA! People still heap sympathy on the mother figure here. Its so easy when you paly victim, so that everyone believes you- but in the end when she is old and gray and rocking in the big lonely rocking chair all ALONE, they will wonder where her kids are. ANd when she realizes that she wants us, it will all be too late. SUre Am, I can forgive, I can semi forget but I cant allow someone to continually treat me like shit and in front of my family. What did she say when you changed your name???? Mine are about to find out in court. A> right I have done on my own...she can't take credit for any of my A> successes,and that burns her self-serving little butt! Mine still tries. al 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Aladrisa Area: Mundane To: Amethyst 6 Nov 94 18:20:26 Subject: Re: Abortion stuff in Metaphysical UpdReq A> I still struggle with that one. I wonder about what I did in my past lives A> deserve half of what I've been through. I sit here and I think "what have A> accomplished with my life?" I have to settle for the small victories that n A> one can see on the outside and I can't put on a resume. Right now, they're A> all I have, but when I consider the statistics on young people like us, it's A> lot. We shouldn't have seen our 18th birthdays...certainly not our 21st. Ki A> like us die in alleys pumped full of dope or get knifed because we stiffed o A> pimps or robbed some john. We don't grow up into mature, responsible adults A> and mothers. We weren't supposed to make it at all and here we are, still A> kicking and fighting (if that's what it takes sometimes) to get through ever A> day, week, year. And sometimes we actually sail instead of always fighting A> the current. A> Geez, I should adopt you. I never had a sister..... If what we did in our past lives makes our life what it is today we must have been REAL LIVE HELLIONS!!! WHat have you accomplished in your life? Hell woman...you've already made 3 or 4 that I know of...Your alive arent you? You survived! Second, you have those beautiful kids and they are thriving. Third, your in a good relationship, yeah it aint perfect but its good. ANd fourth, you did not sit back and let people sterotype you, you went out and gave the truth. It doesnt seem like much but to us it is ALOT!!! Sailing? I wish! I wonder if the fire will ever dim out when I become older... Transmuting...and thats what you have already begun. bb al (and a safe hug too) 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Aladrisa Area: Mundane To: Amethyst 6 Nov 94 18:21:02 Subject: Re: Anouncement UpdReq A> Even in the rare cases when a man has managed to get an injuction, the woman A> has always managed to sneak off to a clinic somewhere and do it anyway. Suc A> women are very selfish in my opinion and care nothing for the feelings of th A> father...it makes me wonder how they could ever have loved in the first plac A> if they could turn around and care so little for his feelings about his chil A> That I have to agree with. SOme women are bitches too. al 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Frendal Fundari Area: Mundane To: Amethyst 9 Nov 94 14:01:52 Subject: Re: Anouncement UpdReq -=> Quoting Amethyst to Frendal Fundari <=- Am> I quite agree with you...the father should have a choice, too. Am> Unfortunately,what happened to you happens all too often because the Am> baby is inside the mother and the law sees it as her body and the Am> father who isn't attached to her in some way gets shafted every time. Yes, that is exactly it. Everyone has taken up sides for the woman, wether is is her choice or her responcibility. Noone thinks of the father (or very few do) and his choice and responcibility. Am> Even in the rare cases when a man has managed to get an injuction, the Am> woman has always managed to sneak off to a clinic somewhere and do it Am> anyway. Such women are very selfish in my opinion and care nothing Am> for the feelings of the father...it makes me wonder how they could Am> ever have loved in the first place if they could turn around and care Am> so little for his feelings about his child. I agree. Although, when a couple who has been intimate has a falling out, there comes complications. Despite the child being both of theirs, and even if the father is willing to take the child that the mother doesn't want, she still legally has the option of an abortion. Oftenly, the father may not have the money to hire a lawyer to get an injunction, or even more often, doesn't have the time to hire one and get the injunction before the woman heads off to the clinic. It really bites to be a male in these situations. Blessed Be... Frendal ... * <-- Tribble */~~~ <-- Tribble Domanitrix 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Frendal Fundari Area: Mundane To: Aladrisa 9 Nov 94 14:28:34 Subject: Re: Anouncement UpdReq -=> Quoting Aladrisa to Frendal Fundari <=- FF> How do you think it would feel to be the MAN in this situation? Al> I have often wondered. But the last time, we went thru it together. It is a real hard situation to deal with. It took me over a year before I would even get close to another woman. I was afraid that things might get close again, and that she would do the same thing. In a way, I can say I am glad it all happened, or I would not have met my wife, but it is still hard for me to deal with. Al> ok- BUT did you want that child so much that you would have been Al> willing to carry it (if you could) to term? Did you want that child so Al> much that you would have been willing to patch things up because SHE Al> was the mother? Well, for the child's sake, I would not have patched things up with her. It would have led to the same thing happening again, and I could not go through it once more. I have always prided myself as being a gentleman, and she is the only woman I have even come close to hitting. (Not that I ever would have, but the feeling was there.) I think it is ufair to stay in an unhappy relationship for the sake of a child. I grew up in such a family, and know how it feels to be the child in that kind of constant abuse. You become a tug-of-war object for the other to get an upper hand. Its a living hell. Would I have carried the child to term? If I was able to, I would have to say Yes I would. I would pull a Sam Beckett (Quantum Leap). Al> It kinda struck me as an EGo trip, and I am not trying Al> to insult you so dont get me wrong, but most men say "MY CHILD" with Al> little regard to the other person involved.... If it seemed like I was presenting an ego to you, I am sorry. I was opening up and letting my feelings do the typing. Yes, I must admit, there was a bit of ego in the message, but when is there not for a Would-Be father talking about his could-have-been child? I know the child would have been both of ours, but as it is obvious by both her actions and words, she did not want the child at all. By that, I say "MY CHILD" as oppsed to "OUR CHILD". I hope that make a little more sense. In a way, her having the abortion actually improved on my being. After I came to terms with what happened, I straightened my life up even more that I had before getting into a serious relationship. I definately knew what I wanted to do with my life, and set about doing it. Although this helped me out tremendously, I cannot help but wonder what my life would have been like. I had missed out on something I find very special. My wife, may not ever be able to have children again, at least without some serious surgery first. Her second child was a hard delivery (100+ stitches from where he ripped her). Now her daughter (1rst child) and her granddaughter (2 years old) are living with us. Money may be a little tight, but being there for Arianna (my step-granddaughter) is something I had thought I might never get to experience. I do get a little frustrated sometimes, but what parental figure can say they don't? Al> also most men would want Al> the woman to go thru with the pregnancy as a pay back. (Not saying Al> that you did)... Not a chance of it. I still cared for her a bit, and if medically there would have been problems, an abortion would have been an option then. I even offered to pay her bills and such while she was pregnant even after we had broke up. We were still on friendly terms at that point, not that we are now. We both knew that a relationship wasn't possible between us anymore. Life goes on... Blessed Be, Frendal ... Tag line thievery ... On the next Geraldo! 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718 From: Christeos Pir Area: Mundane To: Rose Dawn 8 Nov 94 18:34:52 Subject: Re: CHAOS 1/ UpdReq * Reply to msg originally in A Net of Magick over the wondering World .. -=> Rose Dawn sent a message to Christeos Pir on 05 Nov 94 07:48:07 <=- -=> Re: Re: CHAOS 1/ <=- Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law. RD> You got that right! Well, I've got a couplea people trying to fix 'er RD> up for me...and if worse comes to worst, I can pick up a brand new HP RD> Deskwriter/Deskjet for a couple hundred. :> No, if _absolute_ worse comes to wurst , I can ship you my old Panasonic 9-pin -- assuming it'll run on a Mac. RD> If you can read 3.5" diskettes, the newer Macs have a File Conversion RD> Program--if I save em as text only--or even as MS Word, I RD> think--someone with a newer Mac could slap em in the FCP, I *think* RD> and you could just slap them into your disk drive. If you have 5.25's, RD> then we're both outa luck. ;> I have both sizes, but I dunno about the tracks-per-inch and all that. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that even if you saved the stuff as ASCII files I could read it without some kind of conversion, right? So, yeah, it'd still require an extra step. How 'bout if you give me the exact file name(s) as they're stored on MM (the Parsons, I mean), and I'll ask Az0th to f/req them from Sis? Your essay I'd have to wait for, I guess. RD> Forget the hardcopy idea...that'd cost a mint to mail! Is it all RD> available in the Arena's file section? If so, we could just do a FReq, I've not u/led them, since they're not finished. If you can't read my disks any more than I can yours, I can still mail it: I'll just make doublesided copies and send it 4th class. Question is, where should I stop: he's still u/ling new additions to it. Just about everything else he's written in available on the Arena and Bapho, BTW, so Sis can f/req anything not already on MM. RD> interested in seeing. If you're not too impatient, I should have a RD> fixed printer, or a new printer, before the end of the month...it'd be RD> sooner, but I've got lots of 'schtuff' going on, know what I mean? ;> Oh, well, that's no biggie. I can wait. 'Course, then we're back to paying the postage each way. I've got a better idea: sell that piece of... uh... _machinery_, and buy a Pentium! Oh, here's a little more info on the King book: _Tantra: The Way of Action_ _A Practical Guide to its Teachings and Techniques_ by Francis King (c) 1986, 1990 Destiny Books One Park Street Rochester VT 05767 ISBN 0-89281-274-5 $9.95 paper Chapters: --------- Pleasure and Pain Power and Passivity Shiva and the Qabalistic Tree of Life Esoteric Physiology Chakras, Secret Traditions, and the Golden Dawn Right-Hand Tantra, Left-Hand Tantra The Middle Pillar and the Serpent Power Tantric Techniques of Yoga and Meditation for Westerners Tantric Rituals for Westerners A Summing Up Appendices: ----------- Brodie-Innes and the Tattvas The Origins of Tantra, Drugs, and Western Occultism The Chod Rite and Asiatic Shamanism Preparation for the Middle Pillar Exercise and Shakti Invocation The Siddhas, Chinese Alchemy, and Layayoga 159 pps, including bibliography and index. No illustrations, but a cover picture by Priya Mookerjee (painter and wife of author Ajit Mookerjee). Love is the law, love under will. - V - ... Mock on, Mock on: 'tis all in vain! 201434369420143436942014343694201434369420143436942014343694718